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Vaunted Customer Service?

Discussion in 'APPLE iPhone, iPad Tablets and all iOS Devices' started by AnthroMatt, Dec 23, 2013.

  1. AnthroMatt

    AnthroMatt Big Meanie
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    I had a Genius Bar appointment this afternoon because my 10-month old iPhone will shut down almost anytime it gets below 30% battery level. One day it went from 76% remaining straight to 1% remaining, stayed at 1% for almost 6 hours (with use!) and then died. As soon as I plug it in the phone powers up and reads at least 22% battery. So obviously stuff is funky.

    Anyway, got the battery tested...the results are displayed on a square about 2" x 2", divided into 4 quadrants. If each square is a 1 x 1, my battery tested at about 1/8" (at most) above the red "defective/replace" quadrant. I was told I could have my phone swapped now for $79 or keep coming back until if fails, "which it will almost certainly do" according the guy helping me out. I have Apple Care I'm not limited to a 1 year warranty, but if the battery is about to fail and a replacement is all but certain to be necessary, why not just swap it now instead of leaving me with a device I cannot rely on and asking me to make multiple return trips until it fails?
     
  2. QLR

    QLR RIP Note!
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    Just damn!
     
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  3. josephd

    josephd Tomorrow is another day.
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    The phone is less than a year old. And they want to charge you to replace a defective device??
    I also like the multiple trips line, that for me is a two hour round trip with traffic.
    Good luck, I hope it works out for you. Keep us posted please.
     
    #3 josephd, Dec 23, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2013
  4. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    Bummer! Very poor customer service to say the least. I never had a good experience asking any non stock question to a "genius" but replacing a battery doesn't take much brains.

    Our nearest Apple Store is 30 miles away and the multiple trips would be totally out of the question for me.

    Sorry Mr. Meanie, good luck if you decide to try again - calling or another trip.

    Keep us posted.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
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  5. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    Sorry Anthro. Did he tell you how many cycles the battery has experienced and the capacity? If it is 80% or less capacity and has less 500 cycles, within 12 months they will replace it. That is the industry standard, even for non-Apple products like HP or Dell warranty for battery replacement. Seems like you are very close.

    I have a thread in the WA Apple forum, which has a link to a free program to tell you the above information. Not exactly sure if it will give the same result as Apple, but probably close enough. If you are close to the above...just run it down to zero every day or sooner, to get it to 80% or less.

    That may speed up the process for you. I'd be curious how the numbers come out regardless. Let us know. There is also a second link giving the experience of others getting battery replaced from Apple. If you meet the above criteria, its seems to work out well.

    At least it will save you multiple trips. I don't remember...is the battery only warranted for 12 months? Even with AppleCare? check that out. Although one poster was 10 days out of warranty and Apple still replaced it for free.


    Best

    http://forums.wirelessadvisor.com/apple-iphone/83280-interesting-battery-monitor-app.html
     
    #5 viewfly, Dec 23, 2013
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2013
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  6. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    Although I am not having any battery related issues, I decided to run the test and got some rather unexpected results.

    The iPad Air is at 102.84% after 22 cycles

    The iPhone5 is at 81.4% after 234 cycles
     

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  7. josephd

    josephd Tomorrow is another day.
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    I will have to study up on this. I am a bit puzzled as how to read the charts.
     
  8. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    We really don't know how reliable that test is. I would take several readings and see the average. Check the original forums to see other results.

    You do have a tendency to fully discharge your phone?


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    #8 viewfly, Dec 24, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 24, 2013
  9. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    The Terms of Service actually say 50% capacity is the threshold. I can swear that I read 80% is the norm and what people are finding.

    Maybe it's 50% over 2 years and 80% at the one year mark. ???

    At least one poster said that Apple was able to check the battery stats over the internet. Actually that makes sense. Since you're been in once maybe ask that.

    I do agree that it was close enough that they should have replaced it, if not by the book then for good C/S reasons.

    http://www.apple.com/legal/sales-support/applecare/docs/applecareplus.pdf

    PS: maybe a kind Mod can correct my spelling from teat to test in the post above.


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  10. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    I am not too sure of the reliability of that test either. The original forum's results are all over the place but I don't believe I saw any with the now capacity more than the designed capacity like my iPad shows.

    I fully discharge my phone about once a month or so, otherwise I charge around 15-20%.


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  11. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    I really doubt that it does more than read an internal clock/counter...probably all that Apple does. I'm sure the counter is right, the capacity may be imprecise either way.

    It's still a useful tool. Most of the ipad results have been high, although not above 100.


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  12. AnthroMatt

    AnthroMatt Big Meanie
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    I did a full reset/wipe on my phone and did not restore from a backup. Annoying, but the battery meter seems to be accurate again. I definitely don't have the battery life I did when the phone was new, but that can't really be expected. Most important to me is having a realistic idea of when my phone is about to die. In my recent testing it has powered down twice below 10%, which I find acceptable enough.

    As long as the powering down between 40 and 20 percent or the going from 76% to 1% and staying at 1% for hours doesn't return, I can live with this.
     
  13. AnthroMatt

    AnthroMatt Big Meanie
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    UPDATE:

    I am back in Sacramento now...made an appointment at an Apple Store here in town this evening, took the phone in, they did the same test the store in Phoenix did, and 15 minutes later I had a new (refurb, I'm sure) phone in my hand and was out the door.

    Inconsistent service, for sure, but I am pleased!
     
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  14. josephd

    josephd Tomorrow is another day.
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    Glad it worked out for you Matt. Good luck with the new device.
     
  15. AnthroMatt

    AnthroMatt Big Meanie
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    And it turns out, based upon my serial number, that the phone is brand new and was made by little kids at Foxconn in week 51 of 2013. :)
     
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  16. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    I was going to post that your phone might not be a refurb. When my iPhone 5 was replaced, it had no nicks on the surface, in fact it was in better condition than the 'new' one I got (it had a very, very slight nick on the bezel). I can't imagine that a refurb would be that clean.

    Seems like you are good to go. Right now I'm trying to convince someone to do the same as you. Go to apple and test the battery.

    I wonder why the battery failed so early. Was it a defect from the start? Or was it in that LifeProof too long under very hot conditions? We will never know.
     
  17. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    vf, you don't have to go the the Apple Store to get the battery checked out :)

    My phone died at 17% yesterday and showed the same symptoms as Anthromstt's including plugging it back I and it starting right away at the percentage it died at.


    Since I have less than a month of warranty left and no AppleCare, I decided to call Apple this morning, they sent a diagnostic script to my phone, I had a choice of text or email, I chose text.

    It was very quick and she scanned it and said the battery was bad and set me up for a replacement at the nearest Apple Store. She assured me it was going to be an exact replacement, unlocked, white, 32 since that's what it shows in their system.


    So far it went well, I will post my experience after I pick it.

    As far as what caused it, I will guarantee it is not heat built up due to cases since I have always used very minimalistic ones. The leather Apple cases is the heftiest one.



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  18. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    Thanks for 2nd confirming that the battery test can be done remotely. :)
    I thought Anthro might give it a go. It is also why I think they are just reading an internal counter, like the other mentioned program.

    I'll pass that confirmation on to my friend!

    P.S. Seems that the vaunted C/S is looking pretty decent still. Must be store to store variations though.
     
  19. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    Alright, stealing Mr. Meanie's thread to post my experience, :D

    At the Apple Store, they said they will re test my battery and that test will override the previous one in the system. Fortunately it tested out as bad in the store as well or I would have been pretty ticked off doing a 2 hour round trip in traffic for nothing.


    Then they informed me that it was their decision what to do and that was to replace the battery and not exchange it. It would take about 30 mins total. I liked this idea, I wasn't too happy about getting my phone replaced not knowing if it was truly unlocked or a refurb. There was absolutely nothing else wrong with my phone and no marks anywhere.


    Although I did walk out of there as a satisfied customer, it was a bit annoying that my entire phone conversation with Apple support was pretty worthless, like there was a disconnect.

    Apple support had given me 4 alternatives.

    1. Take my phone to UPS and they will pack it and send to Apple, after they receive it they will send me a replacement. Total time without a phone 5-7 business days.

    2. Pretty much the same but Apple sends me a box to my home and I pack it up and take it to UPS.

    3. They put a hold on my CC for full retail and for $29 they will send me my replacement and lift the hold after they receive the phone.

    4. Go to the nearest Apple Store and get it replaced, they even called the store to verify they had an exact replacement.

    I guess, even though Apple will run diagnostic over the air, the store makes the final decision.

    At least this is my first good experience at the store in 3 years, so I am happy. :)


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  20. RadioRaiders

    RadioRaiders RF Black-Belt
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    This thread reminds me why I always try to buy phones with removable batteries :D
    Why are so many people with new iPhone 5's having battery problems? :confused:
     
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  21. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    Charylee,

    I don't see how you are taking over the thread, it's in line with the process that Anthro tried. ;)

    I'm glad it worked out for you. If you never had the phone conversation, you would not have been motivated to go to Apple (or have a phone sent to your home), so it was not totally meaningless, IMO. You got your problem solved :) If the Apple store said the battery was good...I think you would have raised a stink with management about what the phone service told you...and they would have done the battery. You had a good case.

    In retrospect, your data point above was hinting at a battery problem, as shocking as it is. It was close to 80% capacity, with only 234 cycles on it. It should be 500 cycles before you get there. (I'm kind of guessing that the iPad data had too few cycles on it to be really accurate, or looking at the data scatter in the plot below, it does happen).

    You mentioned that the battery data from posters over at MacRumors was all over the place. The few (out of 200+ posters) that had 80% or below, and did something about it, actually got either a new battery or a new phone.

    A fellow I communicated with there made a plot of all the data that was posted. It doesn't look so random anymore. I thinking that the program just reads a file inside the iOS, and that data is generated by just measuring how many hours it takes to bring the battery to 100% , at the 1 Amp charge rate of the Apple charger. That means the accuracy depends on the battery meter being calibrated. That may explain the data scatter. How you use/charge/discharge the battery would explain scatter too.

    Here is his plot, and you can see where you were standing (80% = 1152 mAH). Did Apple actually tell you any numbers? Or just bad or good? Or squares.

    My iPhone 5 battery (both phones) is doing fine for its age.

    [​IMG]
     
    #21 viewfly, Jan 10, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2014
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  22. budney

    budney Resident Headbanger
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    Aren't both phones in question last years i5?

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  23. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    Yes they are budney, from February 2013 almost a year old.


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  24. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    vf, thanks for the chart, yes now it doesn't seem so random.

    I agree my previous numbers were ominous, In fact I recall discussing that with Anthro off line.

    If the Apple Store said that the battery was good, then "raised a stink" would be a gross understatement. :D.

    No they never told me what the numbers were, it was a very quick test and he said "yep the battery is bad".

    Anthro's and my phone were purchased on the same day so I am guessing from the same batch, it would be interesting to find out if the battery issue is batch related.

    Glad yours are doing well. :)


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  25. josephd

    josephd Tomorrow is another day.
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    So far, no problems with my 5C.
     
    #25 josephd, Jan 10, 2014
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2014
  26. RadioRaiders

    RadioRaiders RF Black-Belt
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  27. charlyee

    charlyee Ultimate Insanity
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    This isn't a surprise to me since my experience at the local Apple Store has never lived up to my expectations.

    None of our Apple products, 6 total were purchased at the Apple Store, primarily because of the poor customer service experience. Even when they do the right thing, they are quite patronizing about it.

    I do have to say that my experience with Apple phone support has been excellent, every time I have called.


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  28. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    It is a surprise to me. Every point that Charlyee raised, I have had exactly the opposite experience.

    Amazon has always been good. I don't even know where to have an interaction with Sony. The survey must be mainly phone call in customer service.

    I buy everything at the Apple store.


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  29. RadioRaiders

    RadioRaiders RF Black-Belt
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    A sample group of 2 usually doesn't yield an accurate picture, I guess that's why Forrester asked 7500 people ;)
     
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  30. viewfly

    viewfly Mobile RF Advisor
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    Congratulations. You just diminished the value of our forums and WA forums polls in one swipe! We are a pretty small group of people here that actually post on WA...I wonder why would anyone bother to come and visit then?

    I disagree with you. I think personal and detail experience on WA goes along way with helping people.

    Regarding the Forrester poll. It says that over the last two years, MS, Sony and Samsung have improved their C/S ratings to finally come in near par with Apple. The point spread is only 1 or 2 points among them all. Congratulations to those three...but it is pretty common knowledge that they copied Apple methods to improve their rankings.

    So now they are the same (if you include the sample error of a few points)

    Isn't a bit odd though, that MS, Sony, Samsung and even Amazon improved their scores by the SAME amount? I mean all of them went up by 6-7 points in one year. The slopes are the same. Statistically that is odd. Apple went up a point only.

    According to BGR, the 3 questions asked by Forrester in 2014 were:

    1) How enjoyable were they to do business with?
    2) How easy were they to do business with?
    3) How effective were they at meeting your needs?

    What did the other 4 do to increase their ratings equally?

    Given that the question was asked in 2014...I wouldn't be surprised that many Apple customers 'needs were not met' when Apple couldn't keep inventory stocked for the demand of the iPhone 5S. ;)

    In any case, I'm glad that the other vendors have finally improved their C/S to be on par with Apple's.
     

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