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Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres why)

Discussion in 'Sprint Forum' started by PCSuser, Jun 25, 2007.

  1. PCSuser

    PCSuser Senior Member
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    Okay, first of all Sprint has the national 1900/PCS CDMA licencse. Therefore, all they have to do is build a 1900 tower where ever they please. Therefore lowering their costs because the licencese is nationwide.

    Where as if they started to build out with 800, they would have swap licensces with other carriers, and setup an 800 infastructure as well - which is way to costly when everything is setup for 1900 (with exception of Roaming Like Native agreements that they have with ACS in Alaska, and Alltel in Montana/Wyoming; but there they don't maintain the towers, Alltel does).

    Also it is impossible to get new 800 licensces because the FCC is only giving out 1900 ones now - its been this way for a while. Also even if they wanted native 800 coverage, they could not get it because the only way to gain 800 now-a-days it to do a licencse swap. But Sprint can not do such a swap because their only liscencse if for the whole nation, and its at 1900.

    Sprint also migh have trouble purchasing a 800 block, because its 1900 licencse it national - and the FCC regulates that carriers can not have overlapping licensces; therefore this would never work because their 1900 lisesce is national.

    But... the thing that Sprint has decided to do instead of building their own towers out in Montana/Alaska/Wyoming is that they pay Alltel for Sprint customers to use the Alltel towers as native service. In return Sprint can not sell or offer service in these areas; but their customers can use the Alltel network as native service. Another nice thing is Sprint does not have to maintain these areas, Alltel (or ACS) does the maitenence.

    Hope this helps explain it a little better.

    Any questions just ask.

    SYNOPSIS:

    Sprint has national 1900/PCS licencse
    - FCC does not give out 800 licencses anymore
    - FCC says Sprints national 1900 licencse would overlap any 800 licencse they bought
    - Lisencse swap would not be in the question; because you can not swap a national lisensce for a regional one
    - Sprint has a 'Roaming As Native' agreement with Alltel in Montana/Wyoming and ACS in Alaska; which allows customers to use those areas/networks as native home service; although the equipment (towers, switches, etc) is owned by Alltel (or ACS).
     
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  2. Fire14

    Fire14 Easy,Cheap & Sleazy
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Sprint or any other carrier can not buy anymore 850/1900 spectrum as there is none left to buy & hasn't been since the last auction (with the exception of any one that bought it & hasn't been using it)

    As for Sprint buying parts of Alltel or US Cellular, yes if they did want to they could, since both are running the same CDMA networks, so they would be compatiable with each other.

    As for adding towers with new spectrum say what they won in the 1700Mhz or the new 700Mhz they can & will add these locations as well, why wouldn't they if they bought it?

    I am sure there are others that will add to these flaws in your theory, and I will leave it at this for right now.
     
  3. PCSuser

    PCSuser Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres


    Thank you for clarifying that for me. I was a little bit confused myself. Thank You again Fire.
     
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  4. RadioFoneGuy

    RadioFoneGuy Powered by HTC FUZE
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    You can have mutiple frequencies band between 850 and 1900 but is limited.
    There are only 2 850 bands, one is the A band and the B band. The FCC only allows a carrier to have one or the other and will normally make the carrier sell off one or the other. Cingular has both 850 bands in some areas due to buying out the old ATTWS and has managed some how to keep both.

    I think you are limited to how much PCS you have as well but you can maintain a little of both. My Company has A band 850 and PCS B,E in some areas and PCS C,F in others and some areas have both 850 and PCS.

    Most of the Frequencies in both bands are accounted for but may not being used, the carrier that has the frequencies may not be using the freq but may have a tower turned up at low power just to mainain the license.

    Cricket/Leap had some 1900 license in northern michigan but only had about 3 towers space over a 3 county area just to hold the license but just sold off the freqs to Verizon which build out a small network. The license in so small that Verizon isnt selling service locally but just allowing its customers to use the network instead of roaming on Alltel as they used to.
     
  5. jimbo

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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Another clarification...

    There is no "national" 1900MHz license (not yet anyway, as the so-called PCS "G-Block" license that Nextel gets after rebanding is complete is not in use yet). What Sprint has is a bunch of PCS licenses for particular geographic areas (MTA's and BTA's), that when combined cover all of the U.S.
     
  6. RadioFoneGuy

    RadioFoneGuy Powered by HTC FUZE
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Good one, I didnt think there was a national license, like in IPCS and Northern PCS country those companies own the license and operate under Sprint name. Sprint will have Northern soon and hopefully IPCS next.
     
  7. PCSuser

    PCSuser Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Sprint is in the process of buying Northern PCS.

    And Shentel is one they are letting stay - and possibly iPCS.



    What I think they should do is tell iPCS either they shape up, or ship out. Move in with iDEN network competing via Nextel brand with iPCS. Then iPCS will crack under pressure.
     
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  8. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    I don't see any reason or need for Sprint to buy Alltel or any other non-affiliate carrier unless it's about greed and trying to overtake other carriers as the new No. 1. Now that they have Nextel they can easily expand their coverage simply by overlaying CDMA on any Nextel tower that they want to. It's a much cheaper and more efficient way to expand coverage and in many areas the synergy process is already in the advanced stages.

    Even if Sprint was interested in buying another carrier such as Alltel I doubt that they would have the money to win a bidding war with Verizon or AT&T. Plus there might also be issues with feds involving another merger like this.
     
  9. Fire14

    Fire14 Easy,Cheap & Sleazy
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres


    And to add to this, since someone just bought Alltel, I don't see them reselling it soon & if they do it will be in pieces, since we all know these private equity firms are all about making a buck & they can probably make a better buck splitting up the Alltel area.
     
  10. RadioFoneGuy

    RadioFoneGuy Powered by HTC FUZE
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Nextel already has coverage in the IPCS areas, at least in northern Michigan. Nextel has towers I should say, coverage is kinda the wrong word to use.

    Sprint could run CDMA but would have to use Nextel's name and not Sprints. Ipcs has already sued Sprint and won in a couple other states for offering CDMA under there own name.
     
  11. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Well then the only way we would see improvements in the IPCS areas is if Sprint buys them out.
     
  12. SmArTeStChIlD421

    SmArTeStChIlD421 Silver Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    i dont think Sprint is in any position to make more buyouts unless they finish the ENSEMBLE migration which is supposed to be finished in October of '07 and the migration from iDEN which wont happen for like 3-4 years........i still think they should speed up thise physical migration process............the sooner we get rid of iDEN the sooner we can finish EV-DO Rev A upgrades and get started on WiMax...........
     
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  13. RJB

    RJB Gold Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    You know it is to bad they could not get alltel they have some really good coverage.
     
  14. SmArTeStChIlD421

    SmArTeStChIlD421 Silver Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    yeah but if you look at Sprint coverage with roaming included......Sprint has some really great coverage too
     
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  15. RadioFoneGuy

    RadioFoneGuy Powered by HTC FUZE
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Sprint is offering the ic502 that uses Nextel 2 way and CDMA voice. Sprint should run CDMA on Nextels 800 and run EVDO on the re-vamped 2100 once the frequency SNAFU with public safety is resolved.

    I would leave the SMR trunking (2 way) on the iden running and kill the data and voice capabilities. Qchat and Kodiak are alot slower hook ups then the iden systems IMO.

    If Sprint did this and Left the Alpha tag as Nextel it may work in IPCS territories. Oh and exclude IPCS out of the roaming PRL, so IPCS doesnt complain about their customers roaming 2 miles away from their own towers.
     
  16. SmArTeStChIlD421

    SmArTeStChIlD421 Silver Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    well they cant because they have 1900 CDMA all over and converting that 800 to CDMA would make licenses overlap......

    second of all 2100 and the 2400 that Sprint is in the process of amassing is gonna be used for WiMax...

    Kodiak is a very bad system but ive heard that as of now QChat is the closest anyone is gonna get to a Nextel look-alike
     
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  17. TelcomJunkie

    TelcomJunkie Bad Handoff Investigator
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Using any portion of the existing iDEN 800 frequencies for CDMA would require all new handsets as no existing ones are designed/type accepted to run that low. Two, no one could roam on that system since no one else's phone would have that new spectrum chunk in them. Third, the FCC has band plans setup which say what parts of the spectrum are used for which services. You can't just go and toss CDMA in the trunking band. The channel spacing and spectrum needs are totally different and putting CDMA down there would wipe out all the neighboring trunked systems.

    In other words, probably not going to happen.
     
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  18. SmArTeStChIlD421

    SmArTeStChIlD421 Silver Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    and in other other words..........hopefully wont happen cuz the benefits of giving up the 800 when iDEN is through are much greater than the benefits of keeping it.............much less the hassles of keeping it
     
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  19. TKR

    TKR Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    I see no reason Sprint will not put CDMA on the re-banded spectrum as iDEN is off loaded from it. Sprint in fact has said many times they intend to do just that in due course.

    Many keep saying the reason they think this will not happen is there are no phones out now set up to use CDMA on that slice of 800 MHz. True. But iDEN WILL be going way, so I don't think the spectrum wil just sit there unused, so somone is going to have to develop devices to use that spectrum - when the time is right and there is a business need to justify such development. With iDEN still fully encamped for now on 800, that time is not yet here.

    Personaly, I think Sprint would be insane to not use it for their core product offerings, be it CDMA voice, EVDO, or whatever. That spectrum has too valuable propogation characteristics to ever let get away, and the competition still has an advantage in most of the country when it comes to signal strength and reach due to thier 8000 MHz holdings.

    As good as Sprint is now built-out in the Atlanta area, the solidity of their coverage still cannot compare to ATT or Verizon due solely to the 1900 vs 800 matter. There are just too many location where Sprint (and t-mo) are weaker compared to ATT/VZW. People may not know why, but they pick up on the fact that their friends ATT or VZW phones seem to always have storng coverage, while their Sprint or T-MO phone sometimes falls short. It leads to quality-of-brand judgements that are hard to ovecome unless you do something about it (i.e. put CDMA on 800 so you can hold water with the big boys). Sprint may have the best technology for high speed data, but people want their phone to work well everywhere they go as a first priority. A 1900 only network makes that much more challenging to provide.
     
  20. RadioFoneGuy

    RadioFoneGuy Powered by HTC FUZE
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    When Nextels 800 MHZ is moved the new freqs are right next to the existing 850 A and B band so the existing CDMA phones should be able to be programmed to handle the new 850 band.

    Motorola being Nextel primary handset provider isnt going to miss the boat. I would imagine they are already working on phones for 850 and the new 2100.
     
  21. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Regardless of whether they plan to use 800 for CDMA or not (I'd put my money on 'not') it's really too early to think about it or worry about it because that decision and implementaion is likely a long ways off. It's not going to happen in the next 2 or 3 years for sure and by then there will be mega improvements on Sprint's 1900 network. Sprint themselves might decide they don't need to make that investment and in places like Orange County, CA where I live coverage couldn't be any better the way it is right now. So I don't see any advantage that having 800 CDMA in this area would bring. So even if they did decide to use it and figure out a way to do it I doubt it would happen in all markets anyway unless used for a capacity thing.
     
  22. TKR

    TKR Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    I have not doubt there are many high density areas where 800 may not offer any advantage at all over 1900 due to short cell radius due to traffic denisty alone. But in most of the country, I think a 800/1900 overlayed solution could provide optimum coverage.
     
  23. SmArTeStChIlD421

    SmArTeStChIlD421 Silver Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    i agree with all of this...........and not to mention.........the prospect of getting more spectrum for WiMax by simply handing in the iDEN 800 is tempting :devil:
     
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  24. TelcomJunkie

    TelcomJunkie Bad Handoff Investigator
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Really? Many times? I've missed it then.
     
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  25. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    Just for the record I don't recall seeing any mention of Sprint having plans to utilize CDMA at 800 Mhz. If there was such a mention I bet it's rather vague and not very specific or detailed.
     
  26. clock3687

    clock3687 Cell Signal?????? Use it!
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    The new hybrid phones all lack the 850 band. When a triband 850/1900/SMR phone comes out, i think it will make a big difference overall. Giving customers full access to your network/roaming agreements and combining PTT would be great and keep a lot of the customers sprint is losing b/c of this. My bro does like his ic502, the sprint network is def a lot better than nextel, but there are some coverage holes around boston where roaming on verizon wouldve rectified that. Does any one know of any phones coming down the pipeline that have that triband functionality?
    Sprint's in an intresting position, they have invested a lot of money into their network, synergy sites, and have some of the most agressive pricing in the industry. They're going to/have been invested in wimax before any other carrier. They have made it clear they will continue to build out wimax. The future looks pretty bright for sprint, with iDen shutdown somewhere near 2010, and who knows what will happen with the 700mhz auction. They don't need to take over another network (outside of some affiliates) and hopefully hold their ground against the other 4 major competitors. :twocents:
     
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  27. PCSuser

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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    If they would come out with a 1900/800 CDMA, 800 iDEN - then I would get a PowerSource.
     
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  28. TKR

    TKR Senior Member
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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    OK, I take the "many times". :)

    (i) For starters, it ("deploy 800 MHz CDMA") was specifically mentioned as a merger plan element on one or two of the investor slides that Sprint and Nextel had as part of the merger announcment a few years ago. The link to that document http://www.sprintnextel.mergerannouncement.com/investor/Investor_Pres.pdf is now down, but it was still up recently.

    (ii) Six months ago, I inquired to Sprint about the rebanding and got the following response:

    Rebanding is a multi-year initiative that will be completed in mid-2008. High Performance PTT on CDMA is expected to be available in 2008.
    800MHz is fully utilized on our iDEN network today.
    We are committed to the iden technology for the foreseeable future
    We have work underway to enable the CDMA network (and handsets) to utilize the 800MHz SMR band
    At some point in the future, we may utilize 800MHz on CDMA but only when the iDEN network does not need all of our 800MHz licenses
    We have a "2nd to none" build plan on our CDMA network that is focused on improving in building coverage, weak spots within our footprint and expansion of our coverage footprint. This build plan consists of several thousand cell sites and will double the number of covered square miles on the cdma network

    (iii) I have also seen referenced elsewhere, I think in some of those long FCC filings that were done prior to the merger approval.

    Go to the FCC merger site for Sprint - Nextel

    Go to near the bottom of the page where it says application documents, dated 2/8/05. Click on public interest statement number 4 (a joint statement by Oliver Valente and Barry West to the FCC). Go to page 22/paragraph 53 wehre they allude to using CDMA (or another next gen network technology) on the 800 band in due time.


    So, no it not a given it will happen, and Sprint has not exactly been highlighing it, but they have alluded to eventual 800 MHz CDMA from time to time. They have to do something with the spectrum when iDEN is sent to pasture.
     
    #28 TKR, Jun 29, 2007
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2007
  29. RadioFoneGuy

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    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres

    I didnt know the hybrid phones werent dual band CDMA capably. So the hybrid customers are getting the shaft in poor coverage areas by not being able to use Verizon and Alltels 850. The hybrid should be Nextel 2 way and both 850/1900 CDMA.
     
  30. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Orange County, CA
    My Phone:
    Galaxy S22+
    Wireless Provider(s):
    T-Mobile
    Re: Sprint buying parts of Alltel, or merging with US Cellular - WON'T HAPPEN (heres


    I don't doubt that it's been mentioned one or two times but don't you think that could have just been merger hype to make the merger sound better? At that time I bet they didn't even know what was going to really happen. Also do you really find anything sent on an e-mail by someone at Sprint credible? I know a few people who work at Sprint and they have yet to ever hear anything or read anything about this and they have access to all that good internal stuff that floats around.
     

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