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HELP! Sprint/Cingular Switch?

Discussion in 'Western US Wireless Forum' started by Sprint/Cingular, Mar 23, 2005.

  1. Sprint/Cingular

    Sprint/Cingular New Member

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    I am aware many people in this forums have their own views and biases, and I would like to encourage everyone to share them freely in how they would handle this situation.

    I have ben a longtime Sprint customer. The first year I was mad as hell with their poor coverage and worse customer service . . . but over the years that has changed, and when the time came and my contract ran out they made me an offer I couldn't refuse to stay on board. And so I did. As of today, their service in the greater Los Angeles area is adequate ( I still DO get dropped calls, no ring- direct-to-voicemail for people calling me and poor reception pretty frequently) , but their wireless web experience is phenomenal. I am paying $40 for 750 anytime minutes with nightime starting at 8 (Which is how it was way back when I originally signed up). $15 more and I have a very good internet package with unlimited SMS, etc, etc. Total is now $55 before fees and whatnot.

    Now then, my girlfriend has Cingular and has invited me to join her in a family plan. Between the both of us it is $80 for 1100 minutes + Rollover. My family has Cingular, so do 3 of my closest friends, (as well as my girlfriend, of course) - so their calls are included. Split it between the both of us and it comes to $40. But here's where the problem begins . . . Given my usage of the wireless web, I need the unlimited package, which now is $25. My own bill is now $65. Then Text Messaging in Cingular is a separate service, so I will have to pay between $3-5 extra for the use I make of it. Plus a whole bunch of Multimedia Services that would have been included in Sprint's $15 Vision but must be paid for separately if I want to use similar services with Cingular. So my bill will now be approximately $70 with less servies than I would have gotten with Sprint!!!! Not only that, but their MediaNet service is terrible, in fact embarrasing, when compared to Vision. It is slower, less reliable, clunkier, much crappier interface, etc, etc. . .

    Now , as for calling area coverage and voice quality (In greater LA), I've found Cingular gets the edge over Sprint. I am using a Motorola V551 and find having conversations with my girl or my folks a real pleasure, feels like a landline! And I can talk to them till the cows come home if I chose to! In my experience more bars in more plaes is not bull****.

    With Sprint I upgraded to a Samsung SPH-A700 multimedia phone and have found the voice clarity much better than my previous phone, but no match for V551. Even this morning I got a Voice Message chime from a voice mail left late last night. My phone had been on for hours before it received the voicemail, just the kind of thing that led me to consider Cingular in the first place. But the Vision service is spectacular!

    So, to sum it up, from my experience trying both systems these past 2 weeks:

    Cingular, Much better voice service AND near unlimited calling BUT sub-adequate and overpriced wireless web. I end up paying at least $15 more.

    Sprint: Phenomenal Wireless Web and very good number of minutes for the buck (but not unlimited to family/friends) BUT only adequate voice services.

    Thoughts?


    P.S. I've printed my experiences and appreaciate your input, but please try to avoid attempts at convincing me that my experiences are wrong. They are what they are for me, the regions where I live and work, etc. Your mileage with Cingular or Sprint may vary, and that's great.
     
  2. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    First of all, Welcome to WirelessAdvisor Forums! :)

    I'm surprised you are still having that many difficulties with Sprint service in the greater L.A. area since they have invested heavily in the last year or two in your market. One of the reasons I left Sprint was also the delayed voicemail thing(and people are still suffering under that today in my area); sometimes I'd get voicemail notifications a day or two late where my phone never rang.
    I've used T-Mobile(Cingular) in L.A. before and was also pleased with coverage and quality, so what it boils down to is whether it is worth to you to get better service where you need it and no need to watch your minutes(Cingular) and pay a little more, or cheaper service with great, unlimited Internet.
    ~Andy
     
  3. Gabriel

    Gabriel TICUS AD MORTEM
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    well, it sems to me that the most important thing for you is your internet/text messaging service. i have cingular, and just like you i get excellent voice clarity as well as reception. however, i never use their Media Net because i find it not useful. when im online with my phone i actually use other sites, such as the bbc for the news, or the weather channel for the weather (duh!), and for ringtones and pictures i use all those free european sites.

    so, in my opinion, one buys a cellular phone to use it to talk, and the web and text and ringtones are secondary. if you get better clarity with cingular, stick with it. dont stay with sprint just because they give you a lot of choices for your vision packages, that is not really what cellphones were made for!! (however, i do agree that it is fun to put melodies in them!!)
     
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  4. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    I'm also surprised about this because my experience here in LA has been the opposite. Very good coverage with hardly any dropped calls anywhere.

    The calls rolling to voicemail with no ring issue is a problem for Sprint. It happens to all of us. It all comes down to luck of the draw. This problem is common when you spend much of your time right in between two or three or more different cell sites. When the phone is constantly cycling through two or more different PN offsets that's when the calls rolling to voicemail trouble typically occurs. It's not really Sprint's fault like most of us would like to think. It's just the way this CDMA technology works sometimes. There are things they can do to reduce it from happening but realistically it will always be around to some degree. One other thing I would like to stress about this is that's it's usually not the result of a weak signal like you would tend to think. In fact it happens more when the signal is stronger.

    But anyway I just learn to live with it when it does happen and accept it because I get a very good deal that no other carrier can come close to matching. :)
     
  5. KevinJames

    KevinJames WA's 1st retired mod
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    then there is the small matter of who you are getting a family plan with--a girl! ;) Take it from me, you will end up with 10 minutes a month, if that.

    Just kidding. But after having the experience of raising two daughters that talk constantly on their phones and having a wife with a plan that has twice the minutes I have, I know that (for me) a family plan would leave me with ZERO minutes.

    Another thing to consider (seriously)....
    Who is carry the account? Family plans mean one bill that *somebody* is responsible for. Since you aren't truly "family" what happens when/if your relationship ends? Do you wake up the next morning and find out you have no service? What about paying your portion of the bill--how will that be worked out. There are a lot of logistics here. I know--I've tried to work out plans for both MY in-laws (now in their 70's) and my daughters and their husbands. It just would NOT work out. I'd end up carrying the account under my name and collecting from relatives that are an hour's drive away is just not feasible.
     
  6. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    Larry, I agree about calls rolling straight to VM being a CDMA problem, and I don't want to start a 'my carrier is better than yours' thing, but since switching to Verizon, this has happened to me less than 5 times and I use between 2000 and 4500 minutes a month(whereas on Sprint I used less than 1500), also while traveling(meaning not only in one market that might be build out exceptionally well). I have to say, though, that the calls rolling straight to voicemail problem on Sprint barely happened to me in Southern California.
    So what are those two carriers doing different? Maybe I have just been lucky with barely any calls rolling straight to vm??? :rolleyes:
     
  7. Sprint/Cingular

    Sprint/Cingular New Member

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    Thanks so much to everyone for their input so far! :)
    Please keep them coming!
    You'd think that after a couple of weeks of experimenting with both companies I would have reached a conclusion by myself . . .

    I think the underlying reason for my hesitation is that I feel that over time plans are getting worse, not better. True, slowly we are starting to get a few more minutes for the same $, but these are the developments that have caught my attention:

    Sprint raised it's unlimited Vision plan from $10 to $15 . . .
    Cingular raised it's unlimited MediaNet from $20 to $25 . . .
    Cingular now changed the Family Plan from $10 to $20 on plans under $70 . . .
    And don't we remember when all "Night and Weekend" minutes used to begin at 7pm, then 8pm . . now 9pm . . . ?

    So I think that despite "competition", many key elements are getting a bit worse. Thus I feel I should lock up to a plan and stay with it before it is gone . . .

    If it was only a voice issue I would heartily jump to Cingular. But jeez, I've never seen a more confusing bill in my life! And their website seems a bit squizophrenic when displaying my account to date . . . And you all already know how I feel about their poor excuse of an overpriced web package . . .
    True, my girl does talk quite a bit, but she has not passed 600 anytime minutes yet, so 1100 plus over 900 rollover minutes we already have, plus unlimited M2M calling with now over 50 million people does have big benefits.

    I think my next step will be to return the Samsung Sprint phone and try out a Sanyo phone, to see if my issue with voice quality and reception improve. If they do, I'll stay with Sprint . . . if they don't . . . well crap . . . I'm back to uncertainty . . . :confused:

    P.S. To respond to the earlier feedbacks in regard to Sprints improvement in SoCal. It's true, I HAVE noticed overall improvement in SoCal with Sprint over the years. But yesterday I had the opportunity to talk with one of my friends (a Sprint user) on both phones (gosh, I MUST be OCD!!!). I definitely noticed much better call quality with the Cingular V551, but when I switched the conversation to the Samsung the voice sounded more metallic, a few more echoes, and yes, a bit staticky. In fact, I had to ask her to repeat herself a couple of times, something she asked of me as well. The same issue used to happen with my older phone, but it was slightly worse than with this newer model.
     
  8. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    If Vision is the most important thing(more important than Unlimited M2M to people you call most and better coverage in your case) then stay with Sprint. I guess that sounds easier than it actually is ;)
    So I guess you are within your 30 day trial with Cingular?
     
  9. Sprint/Cingular

    Sprint/Cingular New Member

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    She's been on Cingular since January, but since I am a family add on, I can bail out of the plan anytime without penalty . . . BUT I have only 30 days to try their Motorola phone before I get forever stuck with its bill.
    With Sprint it's been years since their contract expired, but if I jump to Cingular, I better return the Samsung, which is a very expensive phone.
    So, I guess my rush to reach a desicion is not so much a contract, but getting stuck with a multihundred dollar bill for a handset, AND having them increase the price of their nonvoice plans again (in a few months). . .
     
  10. NYCDru

    NYCDru Sprint Newbie
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    The rolling to VM without rining only ever happens to me when I work in a building in times square wich makes sense.

    The problem for sprint is the EFFECTIVE range of a CDMA PCS cell in an urban area is somewhere in the .4-.9 mile range. As such bouncing between cells/PN offsets can happen alot more often than with a Cellular CDMA cell with it's range being more in the area of .9 - 1.9 mile range in an urban area.
     
  11. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Andy,

    It's all about luck really. I know some Sprint user friends of mine who say they never have calls go to voicemail without ringing. Then there are some like me who it happens frequently to. It all depends on location it seems. In my case it's because I cycle through about 4-5 different PN offsets. This is mainly because I live in the hills. I also know some Verizon users who this happens to just as much.
     
  12. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Yes I can see how the PCS frequency might contribute a little to this issue.
     
  13. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    So I guess I am lucky :D
    At my house, there is only 1 PN Offset I get with my VZW phone from a tower 1.5+ miles away(which I guess is a good thing). Sprint cycles through 4 PN Offsets at my house, but still the signal is at -100 to -106 and Ec/Io -8 to -31.5
     
  14. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    Yeah-I guess that makes sense since the phone will scan through more PN offsets more, giving the call a better chance to roll straight to voicemail. But somewhere I've read that if your phone does scan through PN offsets and you receive an incoming call and the network doesn't find you right away it will send a page via all sites in a geographical area to find you. If that was the case I don't see the reason why calls would roll straight to vm unless the Ec/Io is outragously high.
     
  15. NYCDru

    NYCDru Sprint Newbie
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    Define outraguosly high. 20+ will normally do it.
     
  16. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    I don't think that's the case. When neighbor lists in area become too large calls will start rolling to voicemail as the phone cannot be found in time to deliver the call. I was told this by several different techs at Sprint that I've spoken with.
     
  17. azcellphonejunkie

    azcellphonejunkie The Cell Phone Junkie
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    Great thread guys! I have enjoyed reading it!
     
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  18. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    Usually when a signal reaches -90 dbs or higher that is the point where a phone will start to cycle through different offsets more frequently.
     
  19. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    But only if there's other PN offsets available. Outside a mall in my area, my Verizon phone will cycle through 2 differnet PN offsets coming from 2 different cellsites, where both signals are in the -60's, and calls don't roll straight to voicemail.
     
  20. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    From what I heard a PN offset won't become completely dominant unless there's at least a -15 dbs difference between it and the next closest one. Once you go past the -91 dbs point nothing can be dominant since -105 is about as high as you can get without losing service. This is just what I read somewhere. Not sure if it holds true though.
     
  21. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    Great information!
    CDMA networks should have, by now, you'd think figured out how to make the phone not cycle through PN offsets that might have about the same Rx power, but an outrageously high Ec/Io. This is what sometimes happens to me: My phone has a good signal(-83 and -7.5 or so), then cycles to an offset further away (-87 and -21.5 or something like that). At this point calls would roll straight to voicemail I'd imagine.
     
  22. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    We can only hope CDMA technology improves in the future. :)
     
  23. NYCDru

    NYCDru Sprint Newbie
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    Wirelessly posted (CDM-9900/131.038 UP.Browser/6.2.2.4.e.1.101 (GUI) MMP/2.0)

    Has the original poster made any progress in there decision? I was just wondering if the Sanyo phone made any difference at all. Also, using both could end up being the best option. That way you get the best data and voice options available. You might be able to get your girl to let you pay less for less minutes used by you.
     
  24. jones

    jones Silver Senior Member
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    cdma IS IMPROVING
    but it's Going in
    2 Opposite ways:
    WCDMA vs CDMA2000
     
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  25. Sprint/Cingular

    Sprint/Cingular New Member

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    :(
    So this is where things stand.

    I am now trying the Sanyo PM-8200.

    What a cheap looking-feeling-grossly-overpriced piece of plastic it is. And the sound quality and reception are no better than with my old Samsung. I don't think it is fair to compare it to Cingular's Motorola V551.
    I have finally come to the conlusion that GSM phones give you far more features for less money.

    After mail in rebate V551 was $150 when bought straigh out, without contract. It has ALL the features of Sanyo 8200 PLUS: bluetooth, SIM card versatility, Quad band world phone compatibility, the freedom to use the bluetooth connection to hook it up to my laptop and use as a modem (you need to be a slick wireless user, instead of the average consumer to get away with this with Sprint), phenomenal voice clarity and connection quality, and good reception without having to resort to a fleet of phones with stick out antennas (Most Sprint phones used extendable antennas, for a reson)! The Sanyo was $280. I know which phone I will be returning.

    Now, then, in the past month I've used 3 separate Sprint phones, 2 of them brand new, and my ear can now tell the difference between the Sprint and Cingular networks: When on Sprint, despite varying earpiece quality, there's always a bit of an occasional choppiness to the voice of the person speaking to you which I have noticed on all 3 handsets. The voice is more hollow and I've had to ask the person to repeat themselves at least 3-4 times more than when on the Cingular network (granted, while on Cingular I've only used the V551, both mine and my girlfriends' - maybe it's a function of the phone being unusually good - I have no way to compare the quality of Motorola vs other phones in the Cingular network). The number of reception bars was the same on all 3 Sprint phones in the same geographic areas. My connection fails in the same places. For crying out loud, my signal failed while retreiving a voicemail while in the heart of a major boulevard in West L.A.!

    As a side note, even when it displays 1 single bar, the voice clarity on the Motorola feels like it has 4 bars! If I was not monitoring the signal I would have believed it was a 4 bar reception call. I am amazed about this because I had never noticed that phenomenon in the 4 years I've been with Sprint. Apparently, the number of bars in my Motorola is inconsequential. So long as there is at least one bar in there, my call quality wass always the same, landline quality. I could not say the same with Sprint.

    I had high hopes for the Sanyo, since so much has been said about reception and voice quality. Well, it feels like a prize from the bottom of a cereal box, and performs as such. I've come to the conclusion that in my neck of the woods, Cingular is much better coverage and voice quality.

    So I guess my only option will be to stick with Cingular, scale down my wireless web usage and get the $20 Multimedia pack, or make do without their mediocre and overpriced premium services "like in the old days." :mad:


    I was thinking that Sprint will soon be moving on to EV-DO. And when it does I'm willing to bet anything thay are not going to offer Ev-DO for the same $15, not even to existing customers. They'll probably increase the price for everyone or maintain $15 for "Vision Classic" and drastically increase the price for those who want EV-DO. No doubt Cingular will do the same with UTMS.
     
  26. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    If you wanted a Sprint phone with a good sounding earpiece you should have avoided the Sanyo 8200. That's the worst one of all.

    The new LG 125 flip is supposed to have better earpiece sound quality.
     
  27. 714tmobile

    714tmobile Senior Member
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    Just out of absolute curiousity, what is your plan? ;)
     
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  28. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    $10 unlimited vision which includes unlimted internet, text, picturemail, and videomail. :) Plus I get a 15% discount off my monthly bill.
     
  29. Andy

    Andy Diamond Senior Member
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    With a plan like that, Larry, do you know how much time I'd spend 'online' and how many SMS I'd send every month? When I had Unlimited SMS I sent/received 10,000+ SMS some months, now I'm done to 500 and making better use of Free IN Calling. ;)
     
  30. larry

    larry Sprint loyalist and former mod
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    I send a lot of picture mail and SMS. It's a good thing I have unlimited!
     

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