Free ATT Wifi for iPhone and BB users.

[viewfly]

T&T is offering free access to its network of Wi-Fi hot spots to owners of the iPhone and certain BlackBerry devices. AT&T has more than 17,000 hot spots at Starbucks, Barnes & Noble, and thousands of other locations. iPhone owners and BlackBerry owners need to have unlimited data plans in order to use the free Wi-Fi. Initially just the BlackBerry Bold will be supported upon its release November 4, but AT&T will add support for the BlackBerry Pearl and 8820 later this year.

[viewfly]

See wifi map here AT&T Wi-Fi Locations

More info

Accessing AT&T Wi-Fi | Wireless from AT&T, formerly Cingular

AT&T Wi-Fi | Wireless from AT&T, formerly Cingular

[bobolito]

I tried to connect at a nearby starbucks and it didn't accept my 10-digit number. I called AT&T and they said they were having a technical problem in this area.

[viewfly]

Yeah, I tried at Starbucks today. Took my number, but said they had 'problems' Hopefully it will get fixed soon.

This is a great peak for the $30 a month. Other users have to pay a monthly fee for the ATT wifi sites.

[Charlyee]

Originally Posted by viewfly

This is a great peak for the $30 a month. Other users have to pay a monthly fee for the ATT wifi sites.

This sounds great but I don't quite understand the advantage of WiFi if the unlimited data plan is a must with the iPhone.

In any case, I am very happy that the iPhone is all you expected & more and that you are really enjoying it.
Palm850/v0100 Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows CE; IEMobile 7.11)

[SmArTeStChIlD421]

well WiFi just means that you get faster service........iPhone and Blackberry users probably consume some of the most data on the networks........getting them off the network unloads the towers.....

and WiFi is faster than AT&Ts 3G network anyway........

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by Charlyee

This sounds great but I don't quite understand the advantage of WiFi if the unlimited data plan is a must with the iPhone.

In any case, I am very happy that the iPhone is all you expected & more and that you are really enjoying it.
Palm850/v0100 Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows CE; IEMobile 7.11)

Well, the four possible things are 1) speed, 2) possible VoIP, 3) better battery life, and 4)where there is no or poor 3G.

Speed is a given. We all want it and more. From GPRS to EDGE, 3G and beyond we have gotten more data speeds. ATT only promises 3G speeds of 2X over EDGE so around 350kbps or so. But 3G will more likely be 780 up to a max of 1400 kbps. GPRS was around 10's of kbps.

With Wifi, at least in my house, I get 3400kbps and sometimes 4900kbps ( almost 5Mbps). So web pages that load like a pc. In my rural home in CT on a few acres of land, 3G is good, but on the fringe. So my local wifi is great. Most likely that will be the case in most of the USA outside the cities. But also, deep inside a building were the RF signals are poor.

Being so close to the wifi source, the battery life should be better esp in a fringe area. But there is some discussion about that.

VoIP. One of the attractions to me was an application called iCall (iCall - iPhone Beta) that lets you take an incoming 3G call and divert to wifi. Also for outgoing. Or someday Skype for iphone, instead of buying a wifi skype phone. Saves ATT minutes and esp for international calling, the charges would be free. iCall is not out yet, but I'm waiting. Perhaps there are some for jailbroken phones. Don't know.

So that's my reason. Like I said it is a great free perk for the iPhone (and BB) data plans. Normally they cost $5 for users (i think).


I'm more than happy with the 3G IPhone. Best and most fun phone that I've had. I actually like the 'keypad'. Some things missing though, but overall, it is a great and useful phone. Mine has been trouble free.

Plus, it is a slim phone. Great for my pockets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Charlyee]

Thanks very much for the detail explanation, makes perfect sense.

I am curious about the battery life & just started to leave my WiFi to "always on" while I am at home.

You have always had good luck with phones so I am not surprised that you have a problem free 3G iPhone.

My 6131 is still going strong & actively used.

PS: Should I thank Apple for bringing you back to WA & actively participating?
Palm850/v0100 Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows CE; IEMobile 7.11)

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by Charlyee

Thanks very much for the detail explanation, makes perfect sense.

I am curious about the battery life & just started to leave my WiFi to "always on" while I am at home.

You have always had good luck with phones so I am not surprised that you have a problem free 3G iPhone.

My 6131 is still going strong & actively used.

PS: Should I thank Apple for bringing you back to WA & actively participating?
Palm850/v0100 Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows CE; IEMobile 7.11)

LOL, Probably, and Nokia too...for not having any good phones and in my price range. Even if ATT carried them, they always managed to leave out a band that I was interested in. I love the wifi and the huge screen. Plus the slimness of the phone, either in a Sena or Incipio case just fits perfectly in my pants pocket.

P.S. my 6131 is still here and a very good backup phone too.

I read that you have a new Treo. I don't know what a 'Pro' is, but I'm sure that you will start a thread.

vf

[Charlyee]

Originally Posted by viewfly

I read that you have a new Treo. I don't know what a 'Pro' is, but I'm sure that you will start a thread.

vf

I did
http://forums.wirelessadvisor.com/microsoft-windows-mobile-phones/72127-palm-treo-pro-review.html#post522530

No Sena case for it yet though.
Palm850/v0100 Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows CE; IEMobile 7.11)

[bobolito]

Originally Posted by viewfly

Well, the four possible things are 1) speed, 2) possible VoIP, 3) better battery life, and 4)where there is no or poor 3G.

Speed is a given. We all want it and more. From GPRS to EDGE, 3G and beyond we have gotten more data speeds. ATT only promises 3G speeds of 2X over EDGE so around 350kbps or so. But 3G will more likely be 780 up to a max of 1400 kbps. GPRS was around 10's of kbps.

With Wifi, at least in my house, I get 3400kbps and sometimes 4900kbps ( almost 5Mbps). So web pages that load like a pc. In my rural home in CT on a few acres of land, 3G is good, but on the fringe. So my local wifi is great. Most likely that will be the case in most of the USA outside the cities. But also, deep inside a building were the RF signals are poor.

Being so close to the wifi source, the battery life should be better esp in a fringe area. But there is some discussion about that.

VoIP. One of the attractions to me was an application called iCall (iCall - iPhone Beta) that lets you take an incoming 3G call and divert to wifi. Also for outgoing. Or someday Skype for iphone, instead of buying a wifi skype phone. Saves ATT minutes and esp for international calling, the charges would be free. iCall is not out yet, but I'm waiting. Perhaps there are some for jailbroken phones. Don't know.

So that's my reason. Like I said it is a great free perk for the iPhone (and BB) data plans. Normally they cost $5 for users (i think).


I'm more than happy with the 3G IPhone. Best and most fun phone that I've had. I actually like the 'keypad'. Some things missing though, but overall, it is a great and useful phone. Mine has been trouble free.

Plus, it is a slim phone. Great for my pockets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There's an app in the AppStore called Fring which will let you do Skype on the iPhone, plus you can use your favorite VoIP (SIP compatible) provider with Fring. I've tried it and it works better than I expected. There's about a 1 second delay on the speech, but you can have a conversation just fine if both parties are aware of the delay.

Now, Fring only let's you use VoIP over WiFi. If you want to use VoIP over 3G and save on your precious minutes you can do so by Jailbreaking your phone and installing something called "VoIPover3G" which is a small plugin that fools Fring into thinking that it is running on WiFi. Voice quality this way is a bit inferior (maybe because it compresses voice more to use a lower bitrate) but still a conversation is perfectly possible. I even tested it while driving and I had no problems.

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by bobolito

There's an app in the AppStore called Fring which will let you do Skype on the iPhone, plus you can use your favorite VoIP (SIP compatible) provider with Fring. I've tried it and it works better than I expected. There's about a 1 second delay on the speech, but you can have a conversation just fine if both parties are aware of the delay.

Now, Fring only let's you use VoIP over WiFi. If you want to use VoIP over 3G and save on your precious minutes you can do so by Jailbreaking your phone and installing something called "VoIPover3G" which is a small plugin that fools Fring into thinking that it is running on WiFi. Voice quality this way is a bit inferior (maybe because it compresses voice more to use a lower bitrate) but still a conversation is perfectly possible. I even tested it while driving and I had no problems.

Thanks Bobolito. I haven't scanned around enough to know about this one. Call quality is upmost for me, and using a Skype Out feature. Does that work?

I also just found TruPhone. Any opinions??

VoIP over 3G is not too interesting to me.

[viewfly]

ok. I was able to log into Starbucks today!

[viewfly]

Bobolito,

Got Fring to work. And it works with Skype Out. This will be great when in Japan, Europe etc, to make cheap calls back to the States using a local wifi. Quality is OK, not great, but I'll give it time.

Truphone: downloaded , but having registration problems. Set CS an email for a fix. Doesn't use Skype which is less convenient, but I'm curious about the quality.

Charlyee, yet another good reason for wifi.

vf

[Charlyee]

Originally Posted by viewfly

Bobolito,

Got Fring to work. And it works with Skype Out. This will be great when in Japan, Europe etc, to make cheap calls back to the States using a local wifi. Quality is OK, not great, but I'll give it time.

Truphone: downloaded , but having registration problems. Set CS an email for a fix. Doesn't use Skype which is less convenient, but I'm curious about the quality.

Charlyee, yet another good reason for wifi.

vf

Thanks viewfly,

All good reasons

I was actually questioning the big deal with AT&T offering free WiFi at Starbucks for the devices they will not activate without the $30.00 data plan. If you mainly use WiFi and use maybe 5Mb of data you would still have to pay for the unlimited data plan anyway.

Makes sense?

[bobolito]

Viewfly, Besides Truphone there's another one called PennyTel but their rates are not as good as Poivy which is the provider I use with Fring. Unfortunately, Truphone and PennyTel are locked to their service only so you cannot use another VoIP provider like you can with Fring.

VoIP voice quality is always dependent on your internet connection more than anything else. So if you use a Starbucks WiFi that's connected to a slow or congested line, chances are it won't sound very good, so don't judge Fring based on that. I've been on conversations where Fring (using Poivy) sounds just as good as a regular cellular phone call, but then again I am often at locations where I get multimegabit connections with low latency so that's a given. But many times voice quality is inferior due to congestion of all kinds on the Internet itself, although it still does not prevent you from having a normal conversation which is the whole point of calling someone anyway.

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by bobolito

Viewfly, Besides Truphone there's another one called PennyTel but their rates are not as good as Poivy which is the provider I use with Fring. Unfortunately, Truphone and PennyTel are locked to their service only so you cannot use another VoIP provider like you can with Fring.

VoIP voice quality is always dependent on your internet connection more than anything else. So if you use a Starbucks WiFi that's connected to a slow or congested line, chances are it won't sound very good, so don't judge Fring based on that. I've been on conversations where Fring (using Poivy) sounds just as good as a regular cellular phone call, but then again I am often at locations where I get multimegabit connections with low latency so that's a given. But many times voice quality is inferior due to congestion of all kinds on the Internet itself, although it still does not prevent you from having a normal conversation which is the whole point of calling someone anyway.

Well C/S at Truphone got me fixed up today. Truphone is working. I just tried Truphone vs Fring back to back at my home wifi, just a minute apart.

There is no comparison: Truphone's audio quality was far, far, far superior to Fring (using Skype Out). Fring sounded like it did the other day- Pretty bad- broken up and compressed. Truphone was like a landline.

Well I have both now. I have Skype Out for US calls, unlimited for $3/month. Calling back to the states from aboard is around $0.06/min (Truphone) or slightly less with Skype. That is pretty cheap if I'm calling home from France. Of course I can call anywhere else in the world too.

All I need to do is bring my Apple Express Port to any hotel and plug in the internet wire (if the hotel has not wireless already). Pretty neat. Or find a free or cheap wifi elsewhere.

[bobolito]

And how does Skype sound via other means like the computer or Skype phone? I haven't tried Skype on Fring so I don't know how it would sound.

When I travel, my problem is finding some WiFi. How easy is it for you to find WiFi when you're abroad? So far everywhere I've been (Germany, Spain, England, Egypt, Mexico, Canada, etc.) it has been virtually impossible for me to find free WiFi, except in the Dominican Republic where any McDonald's, Burger King or even at the airport all have free public WiFi.

I'm glad you like Truphone so far. Have you tried it over 3G? Does it even work over 3G?

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by bobolito

And how does Skype sound via other means like the computer or Skype phone? I haven't tried Skype on Fring so I don't know how it would sound.

When I travel, my problem is finding some WiFi. How easy is it for you to find WiFi when you're abroad? So far everywhere I've been (Germany, Spain, England, Egypt, Mexico, Canada, etc.) it has been virtually impossible for me to find free WiFi, except in the Dominican Republic where any McDonald's, Burger King or even at the airport all have free public WiFi.

I'm glad you like Truphone so far. Have you tried it over 3G? Does it even work over 3G?

I would say that Skype is very, very good on my pc. But it is really bad with Fring. Truphone is much closer to Skype (on the PC that is). I'll see how it pans out over time, but my datapoint matches some of the on line reviews. Both are free appls on the Apple store.

To tell you the truth, I haven't looked much for free wifi overseas. But most companies I deal with have it set up, and of course I can set up my own in the hotel, where there is perhaps wired internet. I justs use the little portable Apple wifi express port.

Narita airport had not free wifi, but cheap enough daily wifi to make it worthwhile.

[viewfly]

EDIT:


BTW, when I ran Truphone, it worked ok, but then later it said that the iPhone was out of memory!

I had to restart. That was weird. Never had that before. I worry that the software is a bit buggy.

vf

[bobolito]

hehe.... you'll see a lot more of that as the number of pages full of apps grows in your iphone. It's like Windows. When things begin to misbehave, just reboot.

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by bobolito

hehe.... you'll see a lot more of that as the number of pages full of apps grows in your iphone. It's like Windows. When things begin to misbehave, just reboot.

Why? Only one app at a time runs. I think it is more likely bad software. Others are finding some of the unofficial software is not adhering to standards and not releasing memory or running things in background. I suspect that is what is going on here.

[bobolito]

This is not about running things in the background. An increment in the number of apps installed will always cause a degrading effect on the OS which is irrelevant to whether or not the apps are running. So you don't have to have them running for them to cause a problem somewhere else because every time you install something, changes are made to the OS. Therefore, jailbroken or not, you can still face the same problems.

Apple programming guidelines do not necessarily make software any safer. As I told you before, I ran into several official apps that are very buggy and I've found more unnoficial apps to be more reliable than official ones. Safari is a good example of unreliable official software. The only thing the guidelines do here is to protect Apple's bottomline and ensure apps don't have features that Apple considers competitive to their walled garden, otherwise they get rejected from the Appstore. Those are the only reasons the guidelines are there. My problems have not increased as a result of jailbreaking. They have increased as a result of the number of apps I now have installed and because now I am doing more things with the iPhone than I did when I got it. Therefore, chances are I'm going to run into more problems as I do more and more things with the iPhone. As you walk deeper in the water, you're more likely to run into problems. It happens with every OS, with every software, with every hardware out there. Many people that have not jailbroken their iPhones can tell you the same thing. Believe it or not, many of those complaining about Safari are NOT jailbroken. As you install more programs in any Windows machine, it will slowdown and will have more problems. That's a fundamental principle of computing that applies to any operating system.

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by bobolito

This is not about running things in the background. An increment in the number of apps installed will always cause a degrading effect on the OS which is irrelevant to whether or not the apps are running. So you don't have to have them running for them to cause a problem somewhere else because every time you install something, changes are made to the OS. Therefore, jailbroken or not, you can still face the same problems.

Apple programming guidelines do not necessarily make software any safer. As I told you before, I ran into several official apps that are very buggy and I've found more unnoficial apps to be more reliable than official ones. Safari is a good example of unreliable official software. The only thing the guidelines do here is to protect Apple's bottomline and ensure apps don't have features that Apple considers competitive to their walled garden, otherwise they get rejected from the Appstore. Those are the only reasons the guidelines are there. My problems have not increased as a result of jailbreaking. They have increased as a result of the number of apps I now have installed and because now I am doing more things with the iPhone than I did when I got it. Therefore, chances are I'm going to run into more problems as I do more and more things with the iPhone. As you walk deeper in the water, you're more likely to run into problems. It happens with every OS, with every software, with every hardware out there. Many people that have not jailbroken their iPhones can tell you the same thing. Believe it or not, many of those complaining about Safari are NOT jailbroken. As you install more programs in any Windows machine, it will slowdown and will have more problems. That's a fundamental principle of computing that applies to any operating system.

I don't think so Bobolito. That a very general and simple statement about software and OS's, which is not necessarily true in this or any all cases.

I've been running Safari for 3 months longer that you have, Full sites only (like Hofo, WA, etc) with nearly zero problems. You can ignore my experience, but there it is. I have 2 pages of appls by the way.

Have you ever been part of a large software development project involving 20 or more people? It's a nightmare, even though we all work together. People have to work to standards and lot's of testing performed for integration issues. Cleanly releasing memory is a big issue with integration. Can you imagine some third party guy buying your software and throwing in his own stuff, without you knowing it? I've seen the results of that personally. Bad!

Of course 'official' software can have bugs. Look to Microsoft Vista, Office, etc. Look to Apple software; Look at the complaints about the iPhone firmware. I'm not saying all the problems people have are related to 'unofficial' software; only that you have increased your probability that it will happen. It's hilarious how all the JB'd posters blame Apple's 2.1 for their problems.

The Jailbreaking Dev Team is not authorized and in no way affiliated with, endorsed by, or supported by Apple Inc. Jailbreaking voids your Apple warranty. Period. And what about the guys writing the individual appls? Really what do they care? They get off of finding bugs, fixing them, playing with stuff: They are not worried about selling a product or protecting a product line's image. Only Apple's Dev. team is.

Most appls on the official itunes store are free or $0.99. It's not only greed that prevents applications from making it. What revenue is lost by Apple preventing a jailbroke software that provides a simple switch that turns wifi on or off? Or one that changes the battery icon, or gives different icon layouts, provides video, etc? Not much $$ if anything ( or competition) is lost by Apple.

It's more that Apple wants users to have a reliable product and they want appls that are tested and conform to their software protocols, so that reliable product can be achieved. It's not to say that developers can't do that or that 'official' software doesn't get through that is not. But clearly some at HoFo (most posters are JB'd) have found problems with JB software too, slowing things down, or hanging, or hidden background tasks. Most iPhone users don't post here or at HoFo, and they are doing fine. They have no clue about software modifications. That is for us guys to fool with, but we also suffer the consequences of that decision. The correlation between JB (perhaps not JB'ing alone, but some of the software ) and problems is not proven, but the correlation is pretty high.

Sure, having more software installed (and running) can cause problems, esp. with a very tight software and memory package as one has on a mobile phone. But pointing the blame at a working software (like Safari), without considering the impact of other software or OS mods you made to the phone is ignoring fundamentals of programming integration. Not every reason why say Safari is crashing is do to Apple's Safari or 2.1 firmware, or that more appls are installed. The number is less important then the way they perform together. The bigger picture has to be looked at. If Apple gave the phone more memory , that would help, as it does with a PC (the main reasons for slowing down). But the quality of the software using the available memory can' t be ignored either.

I'm investigating something new now. As you know, I installed the 'official' iTunes store appls, TruPhone and Fring. So for the first time, as you know, I got an 'Iphone memory is low' alert. It only showed in TruPhone software though. No where else. I restarted and it disappeared, and then came back just by turning on TruPhone. I don't like Fring's audio quality with Skype, and while googling, I found some battery draining issues with Fring, plus other complaints about memory.

So I deleted Fring. Well the jury is still out, but no more memory problems with TruPhone and it seems to run faster too. Time will tell. But considering these are the most recent software additions I made, it is always best to look backwards one step.

Well good luck. I've got the feeling your going to dump the iPhone if the problems continues. Personally, I wouldn't have JB'd less than 24hours of having a new phone. But I understand the urge! New Apple firmware will address bugs, but I'm sure they are not worrying about the tiny percentage of software users that violate their warranty!

[bobolito]

I can imagine Fring would have battery drain issues considering that to keep a SIP connection alive requires polling which means you have to keep that transmitter (WiFi or 3G) from going to sleep. Having said that I never considered Fring to be a program that you must keep open at all times. The way I think about Fring is an app that you run only when needed. Besides, you can only run one app at a time so keeping it open and connected to the SIP server will prevent you from doing anything else on the iPhone.

But don't worry, I don't have any plans on dumping the iPhone. On the contrary, I am very happy with it, and unlike the "crybabies" in other forums I don't have any significant problems with it. The only problems I have are the same that any other user could have, such as some buggy apps. I can't blame the iPhone or its firmware for that. If I have to enumerate the most buggy apps in my iPhone, I can only name Safari, FStream, Tuner and Paypal, all of which are official apps. However, the worst of all was the Paypal app. I could never login with that thing so I removed it. The Ebay app works 1000% better. All other apps have near zero problems. But I'm sure Apple will figure it out and make Safari more reliable, just as they have been improving and fixing its bugs since 2.0.

And believe it or not there is quality control for jailbroken apps too. They don't just put out apps and forget about them. They're under constant updating and improving. Cydia is implementing a rating system for apps much like the one in the Appstore. Also, not all unofficial apps are free. Some of them give you a free trial and then you can decide whether to buy them or not. You can't do that with official apps because on the Appstore you have to pay before you even try the apps. Before I tried Cydia apps, I was a little skeptical as you are, but after seeing how the system works, I can only say this system rivals the official Appstore in terms of quality and reliability. And frankly, I JB my iPhone a little after 24 hours of ownership only because before buying my own iPhone I had already experienced how everything works in a "jailed" environment.

I haven't rebooted my iPhone since last week so I think it's a pretty solid performer. Unlike my Windows Mobile PDA which required an almost daily dose of rebooting. That was shameful. After trying the iPhone, I don't think I will ever go back to a WinMo based device ever again.

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by bobolito

I haven't rebooted my iPhone since last week so I think it's a pretty solid performer. Unlike my Windows Mobile PDA which required an almost daily dose of rebooting. That was shameful. After trying the iPhone, I don't think I will ever go back to a WinMo based device ever again.

Well, that is good news! Glad to hear that.

So far no memory problems after removing Fring. Something fishy about that program, even when it is not active, it seems to be active somehow. Even my battery life seems better. I should reinstall it to see the effect, but I don't really want too.

P.S. Just went to Engadet full site. Read a few articles, followed a few links to other articles. No crashes with Safari so far.

[bobolito]

Yeah, Safari is really weird. I spent the whole day yesterday on different sites, not a single crash. It seems to depend on the direction the wind is blowing. That's the problem with those kinds of bugs. They are really hard to reproduce even after you think you've duplicated the right conditions.

I've also noticed improved battery life as I use my iPhone more. I remember the first couple of days I was a bit dissapointed, but I haven't reduced the number of hours I spend playing with it and it does seem to last longer. I used to need to recharge it about twice a day, but now with one charge per day I still do all I want.

Anyway, going back to the original subject, I'm going to try a Starbucks today to see if it accepts my 10 digit number, otherwise, AT&T is going to hear from me. There have been countless times before I got my iPhone where I couldn't find free WiFi but some paid WiFi was available, like at the airports. With this new capability I should be able to forget those days, if it ever accepts my 10 digit number.

[viewfly]

Originally Posted by bobolito

Y

Anyway, going back to the original subject, I'm going to try a Starbucks today to see if it accepts my 10 digit number, otherwise, AT&T is going to hear from me. There have been countless times before I got my iPhone where I couldn't find free WiFi but some paid WiFi was available, like at the airports. With this new capability I should be able to forget those days, if it ever accepts my 10 digit number.

It should work. I was able to log into Starbucks earlier this week. Good Luck!