Cingular L.A. at Capacity?

[fleaman]

So, I've had Pacbell (now Cingular) for about 3 1/2 years in Los Angeles. Other than Pacbells/Cingulars horrible customer service, I have been very happy with the Reception/call quality throughout L.A. Compared to all my other friends (ATT, Sprint, Verizon), I have always seemed to have great service and call quality. Since I have rarely needed to call customer service, I've dealt with their unprofessional attitude.

But, in the last 6 months, my incoming calls have been getting progressively worse "all circuits are busy" messages and I'm starting to get voice mail messages instead of the direct call. This has become a daily event now and before 6 months ago it maybe happened only a couple of times a year!
This is getting real irritating as people are telling me they can't get through for a couple of hours! This seems to happen every day now.

My question is this: Should I switch to Verizon? In the past, Verizon (was Airtouch?) used to have this very problem that I'm having, the (what I think is) at capacity problem. But now (according to a friend that works at Verizon), Cingular (L.A.) is supposedly at capacity and because of their network, they can't do anything about it, it will only get worse (Cingular's cust service also says they can't do anything about it---but wouldn't elaborate why!).
Verizon (according to my friend) has spent zillions upgrading their network and no longer has the capacity problems that they used to have. And supposedly their coverage has improved (this seems to be true according to a Verizon holding friend of mine).

Is any of this ring true? Is Cingular working out a plan in the near future that will solve the capacity problem? I think that Cingular L.A. is GSM and I know Verizon is CDMA.

Remember, other than the apparent capacity problem, I'm very happy with Cingular's service coverage/call quality. I really don't want to give that up....but if this capacity problem is not solvable in the near future (3-6 months), then I must think of switching.

As a interesting note: When my friend’s say they can't get through (circuits busy or straight to VM), I also try from a land line to my cell and get the same message. THEN, I try calling out from my cell and it seems that I always can make the outgoing call, but not able to receive incoming calls! Logic tells me this is not a cell tower capacity problem, but some other problem with cingulars internal landline networking. Am I wrong?

Help!

Flea Man

[KevinJames]

Your observations have been echoed here before. From what I can gather Cingular has oversold its LA market and due to NIMBY, legistation and lobbyists, is running into difficulty expanding its network in order to meet demands.

If you decide to change, Verizon and ATT both would be good options. CDMA for Verizon has been a "god-send." Back in the analog days, Verizon probably reached capacity quickly. Now that they are using a technology that gives them the most "bang for buck" (best digital utilization of bandwidth) they have pushed back the increasing tide of users maxing the system out.

Obviously Cingular will have to do "something" about the issue but it won't come anytime soon.

[larry]

Sprint does not have any capacity problems in LA. I have friends and family who use it all over and none of these things that you describe are happening. In fact the service only continues to get better and better all the time. I think that the CDMA gives them an advantage over GSM in capacity issues.

[fleaman]

<< Sprint does not have any capacity problems in LA. I have friends and family who use it all over and none of these things that you describe are happening. In fact the service only continues to get better and better all the time. I think that the CDMA gives them an advantage over GSM in capacity issues. >>



Well, ImHo Sprint sucks in L.A.! Everyone I knows that has/had Sprint In L.A. have had Horrible reception/call quality. Granted, It seems to have gotten better, but I still think it is the worst cell Provider in L.A. I have heard from my Sprint friends that once they leave L.A., Sprint is actually pretty good in other parts of the country, but they really suck balls in L.A.

3/4 years ago it was like this:
1. Pacbell (now Cingular)
2. Airtouch (now Verizon)
3. Nextel
4. ATT
5. 2 Cups and a string
6. Sprint

Remember, these are my observations for Los Angeles only!

Now that Cingular has this Capacity (?) problem and also because it "seems" Verizon's coverage and Capacity has improved, I may switch. But I'm not really sure about how much better Verzon might be over Cingular...I’ve read negative comments on both in these forums.

Flea Man

[larry]

Well you're wrong. You mention 3/4 years ago and maybe you have a point but certainly not today. Things do change. If you don't currently use Sprint in LA or have recently been a Sprint user here you shouldn't even be commenting in my opinion. Let us with the personal experience do the talking. All of my friends and family who use Sprint say it is much better than Cingular and that includes in most of the greater LA area. Cingular customers are all getting busy signals while Sprint users are not. Plain and simple. I won't comment on the other carriers because I haven't used them. It's funny how there always has to be someone here to come in and get a few jabs on Sprint when in reality they don't really know much about the current Sprint network here.

[fleaman]

<< Well you're wrong. You mention 3/4 years ago and maybe you have a point but certainly not today. Things do change. If you don't currently use Sprint in LA or have recently been a Sprint user here you shouldn't even be commenting in my opinion. Let us with the personal experience do the talking. All of my friends and family who use Sprint say it is much better than Cingular and that includes in most of the greater LA area. . >>



I still have friends who have Sprint---as far as reception coverage/call quality, it still sucks compared to Cingular (In my area). I don't make jabs in ignorance my friend.



<< Cingular customers are all getting busy signals while Sprint users are not. Plain and simple. I won't comment on the other carriers because I haven't used them. It's funny how there always has to be someone here to come in and get a few jabs on Sprint when in reality they don't really know much about the current Sprint network here >>



Well, of course that was my Current complaint about Cingular. Sprint might well have open lines, but I still wouldn't switch to Sprint, considering how 3 of my Sprint friends do not have reception in many areas that I do (and so far, I have yet to see them have reception when I don't). It does seem like Sprint has improved in the last 4 years...from Cans and strings to something that I at least acceptable for Cell service (but still is NOTHING like their commercials claim, at least in L.A.).

As of this date I still think Sprint is at the bottom of the list. They have improved, but so has everyone else. This my friend is from feedback from people I know that have all of these carriers.

Flea Man

[larry]

Would you mind giving me some specific locations of where you say Sprint sucks and doesn't have reception? I can give you some specifics on where Cingular sucks and Sprint is much better so it goes both ways here. Sure it all depends on where you're at and where you want to use it but let's not say that it sucks everywhere in LA because no carrier has complete coverage here and I don't think it's fair to make blanket statements like that. If you read the Sprint newsgroup regularly you will find that most users are very happy with their service in the LA area compared to cingular. Oh and by the way I'm a former Cingular user when it was Pac Bell and doubt that they were ever No. 1 in LA. I'm sure verizon and AT&T would have to disagree.

[fleaman]

<< Would you mind giving me some specific locations of where you say Sprint sucks and doesn't have reception. >>



Oh jeez, do I really have the time? Fine:
2-3 years ago my boss and his wife switched to Pacbell (from Sprint) on my suggestion. Result? They actually can use their phone in Malibu, Malibu canyon, More places in Calabasas and according to them, have much better reception in most of the S.F. Valley...Oh my GOD!

Guitar Center Hollywood, 'bout 6 months ago. A salesmen there was on Guitar Centers phone (hard line) and was talking to Sprint's customer service---wanted to end his contract now! Reason? Couldn't use his phone in most of L.A. (his quote to C.S., not mine). He was yelling at them because he couldn't even use his Sprint phone to call them. I offered my Cincular phone as example of call quality (I was on my phone INSIDE Guitar Center--perfect call quality), he was truly amazed.

There are many more---but really, I don't ask my friends what their exact location is when they get disconnected, didn't think anyone was going to drill me for this type of info.



<< I can give you some specifics on where Cingular sucks and Sprint is much better so it goes both ways here >>



No ____. "...reception coverage/call quality, it still sucks compared to Cingular (In my area)." That was my quote. "In my area" should give you a clue. Do I care if Sprint kicks Cingular's ___ in areas I've never been or probably may never be (John's basement on De Soto ave in Long Beach?) ? Nope.



<< . Sure it all depends on where you're at and where you want to use it but let's not say that it sucks everywhere in LA >>



Excuse me?? Did I say it sucks EVERYWHERE IN LA?? NO! Get it straight if you’re going to attempt to quote me. And if this wasn't an attempted quote, then don't lump me into what you are saying.



<< because no carrier has complete coverage here and I don't think it's fair to make blanket statements like that >>



No ____. And your wrong again...'cause I never said that.



<< If you read the Sprint newsgroup regularly you will find that most users are very happy with their service in the LA area compared to cingular. >>



That's fine, I'm happy for them. Note to self: Don't read the Sprint N.G.



<< . Oh and by the way I'm a former Cingular user when it was Pac Bell and doubt that they were ever No. 1 in LA. >>



Well, what part of "Remember, these are my observations for Los Angeles only!" did you not understand? Maybe the "my" part? But in any case, I actually do remember Pacbell Wireless was voted #1 in call quality by some group I don't remember (about 3-4 years ago). I'm sure someone in these forums might know about it, I really don't have the time to search it and I don't care.



<< I'm sure verizon and AT&T would have to disagree >>



Well, as I have already mentioned, I'm now considering Verizon. As for AT&T: Just got back from Mammoth mountain and June Mountain (yes Cincular works there). As luck would have it, my friend that I went with has AT&T. She also had reception in Mammoth (Think it has to do with AT&T and Cingulars partnership to improve their networks among the nations hwys). Well, we both had our phones on at the same times, we both were together all the time and we both got calls on Sat morning. I also got calls on Sunday (she did not) and 1/2 way back from Mammoth (Monday) she got pages from Sat. night and Sunday! Apparently her friends called her but it went straight to V.M. instead of ringing her phone. I got all my calls on everyday. So in this case, Cingular came through----even though my complaint about them has been the capacity problem (didn't seem to be a problem compared to AT&T, this time).

Ok, I have some more time to burn. I live in Silverlake. In my house, Cingular works (of course!), Verizon works. AT&T no. Sprint no.
I know Cingular works well in Big Bear (and most of the drive up), Malibu, Malibu cyn road, Las Virgines rd (as already mentioned), most of Silverlake, Echo park, Los feliz, Hollywood (& hills), Atwater. This is just in my immediate area...where I spend most of my time. But I have been through L.A., Valley, West Side, etc., so I'm not going to give you a damn list. I will say that I very rarely go to O.C. or San Diego.

I'm curious, does Sprint work in Big Bear? Mammoth and June? Not that I'm going to switch, but I'd be surprised if it did (as a note, a friend who switched from Sprint to Pacbell 4 years ago said sprint didn't work in Big Bear).

Well, I'm tired. But I already said Sprint has gotten better...but not good enough for me, yet. And "yet" is the key word. You can quote me on that.

Flea Man

[Rich]

Hey Fleaman,... chill out...I think Larry was just trying to help. It's just a cell phone..!!![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

[larry]

Thanks Rich, I was just trying to help...I could go on and keep it up with this loser but I'm not going to waste any more time with it. Notice how he keeps referring to the past and what happened 3 or 4 years ago. LOL He doesn't have a clue about the present.

It is very difficult to compare Sprint's service 3 or 4 years ago with what is happening today. I also can comment on many places that he has referred to about not having coverage (covered now) but I don't see a point to it. I sense a closed mind.

[fleaman]

Sorry if it seems I got a little harsh--but only after I have been misquoted, told I shouldn't be commenting, accused of making statements out of ignorance and had words put in my mouth that came from someone else’s mouth. Remember, I didn't start anyone one of these "attacks" 1st. Larry started off on his high horse, and I (unlike Larry) have given some excerpts of his exact quotes below.

Larry wrote:


<< If you don't currently use Sprint in LA or have recently been a Sprint user here you shouldn't even be commenting in my opinion >>





<< Let us with the personal experience do the talking >>





<< It's funny how there always has to be someone here to come in and get a few jabs on Sprint when in reality they don't really know much about the current Sprint network here. >>



If Larry mistook my comments on Sprint as a "Personal' attack on him, well I'm sorry. It is clear that while I was hard on Sprint, I Never attacked Larry personally (at 1st), but it seems that he "took" it that way. Obviously I did attack Larry after some of his comments. If the rest of you would not, then I am impressed that your maturity exceeds mine. I probably did sink a little below Larry’s level on my reply.

As for present day Sprint: I have repeatedly said Sprint has gotten better and improved since 3-4 years ago! I don't know why you guys haven't noticed this?!?!?! My point (again) is that I still think Sprint is at the bottom of the pack compared to the other boys. Again, Sprint has improved---so has everyone else. I have much more experience from many users than I'm letting on to be and if Larry would read my posts again he would see that I talk about the present along with the past.

And you know what? It was just my opinion---I don't mind people disagreeing with me, I encourage it. But I think there is a right way to disagree and a wrong way.

If I'm a loser for this and I have a closed mind then I guess I’m in the wrong forum.

If you guys really think I had no right to defend what I said and Larry had all the right to attack me personally at 1st, then please tell me now, I don't want to continue my life living as a total _______.

And even though I hate having to make a point (it really makes me look like a nitpicker), you should all notice that I was at 1st very cordual to Larry---even on my post following all of his above quoted comments. It wasn't until the 2nd round that I decided (for better or worse) to let it all out.

I really do want help...but I guess I'm not going to get it here.

Peace, Flea Man

[larry]

Fleaman you suck. Where did I attack you personally?? You said: "Sprint sucks in LA", even though you were never a user and were basing it on 3 or 4 years ago. I call that a blanket statement that can be challenged. I was just trying to debate the issue in a mature way and obviously you didn't want to do that. I'm not the one who's resorting to inappropriate language and making insane posts that are a mile long. Just go away.

[fleaman]

Larry wrote:


<< Fleaman you suck. >>



Fine, I hope you feel better now



<< Where did I attack you personally?? You said: "Sprint sucks in LA",. >>



Exactly. I said "Sprint sucks in LA", you Added "Everywhere in LA" to my (?) quote. I would never be as dumb to make a claim that it sucks "everywhere", how the hell would "I" know?
I have noticed Other posters making the same "Sprint sucks in LA" claim". You have also disagreed with them...fine. Your comments in this thread have given me the impression that I have no right to make this claim, because I not a Sprint customer. So from this Larry logic maybe I should say that "since you don't currently use Cingular in LA, you shouldn’t even be commenting in my opinion"; "let us with the personal experience do the talking". It's ok for you but not me? Are you allowing people to make comments only about the carriers they have? Not their experience and knowledge from friends and family that have other carriers? Since you Commented on Cingular and you don't currently have Cingular, you only apply this logic to others, but not yourself?



<< even though you were never a user and were basing it on 3 or 4 years ago. >>



Please, either read my posts all the way through or don't bother. I posted repeatedly that Sprint had improved. I will also repeat: I have Sprint holding friends in my areas--currently. All of them joke about the coverage. All of them have said it's improved. All of them still think "I' (Cingular), Verizon and maybe AT&T are better.



<< I call that a blanket statement that can be challenged >>



You can challenge a statement, but I didn't make a statement that it sucks "everywhere", only that Sprint sucks in LA, that is an opinion, my opinion.
Your opinion is different, fine. You didn't just give your opinion. I have already posted how you attacked me personally. Since you asked, I will quote myself: "I have been misquoted, told I shouldn't be commenting, accused of making statements out of ignorance and had words put in my mouth". I already put 3 quotes from you in my post. This is how I came to that conclusion. I will post your quotes again so it is easy for you to see:


<< "If you don't currently use Sprint in LA or have recently been a Sprint user here you shouldn't even be commenting in my opinion" >>




<< Let us with the personal experience do the talking >>




<< It's funny how there always has to be someone here to come in and get a few jabs on Sprint when in reality they don't really know much about the current Sprint network here >>



I was looking around this forum and noticed that your main home area is O.C. You even made a comment that O.C. is Sprint’s strongest area. Well, the topic I started was about L.A. I listed some of my most frequent LA Cell usage areas (as you requested). You may not be so familiar with using Sprint in my areas, but I know people who are. You may not know how well Cingular works in my area, but I very much do know. I already mentioned my main complaint with Cingular is the capacity problem. My opinion still stands that Sprint doesn't cut it in my areas---and according to my Sprint friends, it's still worse than Cingular/Verizon in many other LA areas (Currently). It wouldn't matter to me if Sprint has no capacity problem as I wouldn’t be able to use the phone in many parts of my area. When I'm with my Sprint friends, I let them use my phone, 'cause I'm a nice guy.
In O.C. I wouldn't know---but that was not what the topic was about anyway.



<< I was just trying to debate the issue in a mature way and obviously you didn't want to do that. >>



I tried. Look at my first 3 posts. Note that I didn't attack you personally in any way, even though you have done so on your 2nd post.



<< I'm not the one who's resorting to inappropriate language and making insane posts that are a mile long. >>



I admit my posts are long. But most of it is due to me repeating what I have already said (as I'm doing in this long post). Apparently you didn't read my posts all the way through.



<< Just go away >>



Well, I was....but then you asked me a question! How could I resist!

Flea Man

Flea man I think it's time for you to flee. Larry's done much more for this forum than you ever will.

[larry]

LOL Thanks.

I wanted to apologize to all the other WA members (except Fleaman) for my part in this ugly thread. This certainly doesn't help the fourms in any way and therefore shouldn't have happened. Hopefully this thread will be retired soon.

[JFB]

It doesn't look like there will be any more useful information added to this thread so we are going to lock it.