Anyone have this problem with GSM?

[COMfr3aK]

My wife switched her cingular from tdma to gsm and got a moto t720. The cingular tower is basically outside our window and both on tdma and gsm say we have 5 solid bars of service. With TDMA and a nokia 3360 as well as Motorola c331t we had clear calls and always 5 bars of service when making calls.

However, now with the moto t720 when making calls the phone will say 5 full bars of service but as soon as you actually start making a call, the bars will drop to 1 or 2 and sometimes the call will die. Then as soon as you end the call it pops right back to 5 bars. I tried using a hands free holding the phone away from my ear but makes no difference. I thought it was the phone so I replaced it with a new moto t720 and it does the same thing.

Now then I though maybe I got two bad t720's however a week ago I upgrade my tdma to gsm and got a nokia 3595 for free and it too does the exact same thing. Starts with 6 solid bars and then when you call it will drop to 1-2 sometimes 3 and sometimes 6 but mostly 1-2 and the other day it also dropped a call and then went back to 6 solid bars. Mostly the nokia has been good when in calls.

Now I have also noticed this does not happen when travel and are on AT&T so perhaps something wrong with the tower I'm thinking?

I don't know, I have called Cingular twice and they tell me it will be looked into and can't tell me much other than offering to replace my phones.

Any suggestions/info/thoughts?

[GoodmanR]

It sounds like your phone is not able to connect to the tower....I don't know....

[Yahoo!Man]

Originally Posted by GoodmanR

It sounds like your phone is not able to connect to the tower....I don't know....

Well i do know GET A NEW PHONE

BUT NOT THE SAME MODEL

[GoodmanR]

Originally Posted by Yahoo!Man

Well i do know GET A NEW PHONE

BUT NOT THE SAME MODEL

Yeah the t720 stinks...

But this is generally a problem much more associated with CDMA than GSM.

[bobolito]

COMfr3aK, it will be a great help to tell us where you are. It is hard to offer opinions when we have no idea what part of the country (city/state) you are from.

I don't believe the problem is with your phone. I have experienced the same exact issue in Providence, RI and I know it is not my phone because it doesn't do that in NJ, PA or CT. The problem may be in your closest tower not having enough capacity and the call is handed over to more distant towers. However, when you hang up your phone shows full signal because it switches back to the control channel of the closest tower. As much as we know the T720 is problematic, this time I don't believe the problem is with the phone. Call Cingular and report the problem. If there's no resolution ask them to switch you back to TDMA or cancel service. I know they don't want to hear that.

[COMfr3aK]

Well I knew everyone would jump on me for having a t720 but it is brand new and the problem does not happen on AT&T. Also, I have the same exact problem with the nokia 3595 so I know it is not the phones.

I am in Guilford, NY, 13780. Sort of near Binghamton (13901). However I am in the Syracuse market on cingular. I am on the last tower before you go 5 miles south nad it's AT&T.

I would say possibly another tower is taking the call except there are no other cingular towers near me that would take the call. Could it be a different antenna on the tower? Like on on the back side or not the one pointed to me that ends up taking the call?

[GoodmanR]

Originally Posted by COMfr3aK

Well I knew everyone would jump on me for having a t720 but it is brand new and the problem does not happen on AT&T. Also, I have the same exact problem with the nokia 3595 so I know it is not the phones.

I am in Guilford, NY, 13780. Sort of near Binghamton (13901). However I am in the Syracuse market on cingular. I am on the last tower before you go 5 miles south nad it's AT&T.

I would say possibly another tower is taking the call except there are no other cingular towers near me that would take the call. Could it be a different antenna on the tower? Like on on the back side or not the one pointed to me that ends up taking the call?

Well if the tower were over capacity, you would be unable to connect to the tower regardless of which panel you tried to connect to, so I don't think that is really what it is. Are you sure there isn't another Cingular tower within range?

[COMfr3aK]

Well where I am is basiclly the middle of nowhere. I am up on a hill and the tower is on the next hill over. It suprises me there is even a tower there...

However, I am 99.9% certain there are no other towers within reach of me. Not even a bar. In fact, the only closest towers would either be Cellular One which I did pick up once when the cingular tower was down but it was like 1 or 2 bars. I don't think the cingular could hand off to the cell one but that is the only possible closest tower. There are no other cingular towers within range of me. I've never seen it say Extend on my phone when I'm anywhere around my house.

[bobolito]

If you have access to Test Mode you can see how many control channels your phone can see. Do you have access to Test Mode?

GoodmanR, it is possible for a sector of the tower to be full while another sector still have some capacity left over.

[MeatChicken]

Are you in a 1900Mhz/800Mhz overlay area?
If so, the phone may "park" on the 800Mhz 5 bar control channel, & when you initiate a call you are switched to a 1900Mhz cell site a mile or 2 away (that you are unaware of it's location). Cingular may be doing this to keep the 800Mhz cell panels capacity for their large volume TDMA/Analog customers in the area.
This would have never happened w/ your TDMA phone,
since it could only operate on 800.

[GoodmanR]

I was unaware that capacity could be divided on a sectorized antenna as well....sorry

[MOTOhooligan]

Originally Posted by COMfr3aK

I am in Guilford, NY, 13780. Sort of near Binghamton (13901). However I am in the Syracuse market on cingular. I am on the last tower before you go 5 miles south nad it's AT&T.

Heh-heh, you said, "nad!" Yeah I'm immature, so sue me.

[COMfr3aK]

bobolito: how do I get access to test mode on the 3595 or do I have to unlock it or something?

I guess that 1900MHz theory is a possibility. There is a new tower that was put up a little further away from me but I never though anything of it. I know when I am closer to it than my current tower my service does not changed but I know verizon users get nothing from it either.

Well it is very frustrating because it causes calls to drop maybe 4 times out of 10 which used to never happen on tdma.

[MOTOhooligan]

Originally Posted by COMfr3aK

bobolito: how do I get access to test mode on the 3595 or do I have to unlock it or something?

I guess that 1900MHz theory is a possibility. There is a new tower that was put up a little further away from me but I never though anything of it. I know when I am closer to it than my current tower my service does not changed but I know verizon users get nothing from it either.

Well it is very frustrating because it causes calls to drop maybe 4 times out of 10 which used to never happen on tdma.

I'm with you, my man. I've got a Motorola TDMA handset and it seems like I get better service that many GSM/CDMA customers in my area. That is probably because everyone has switched from TDMA so there's a lot of open bandwidth out there.

[bobolito]

Originally Posted by COMfr3aK

bobolito: how do I get access to test mode on the 3595 or do I have to unlock it or something?

I guess that 1900MHz theory is a possibility. There is a new tower that was put up a little further away from me but I never though anything of it. I know when I am closer to it than my current tower my service does not changed but I know verizon users get nothing from it either.

Well it is very frustrating because it causes calls to drop maybe 4 times out of 10 which used to never happen on tdma.

The phone switching to 1900 during a call is a possibility, but I highly doubt it because that's not the way the GSM overlays are being done. It is done the other way around where control channels sit at 1900 and voice channels at 800Mhz, so when you are talking your signal should increase. Like I said, I've experienced this phenomena and I know my phone was sitting on 800Mhz all the time since I monitored the channels. Honestly, I had to force my phone to roam on T-Mobile so my calls didn't drop. However, this happened to me when the GSM overlay was relatively new in Providence. Right now it is not happening anymore since Cingular fixed the problem.

I am not sure how to get Test Mode on a 3595. Nokias have become notoriously hard to get Test Mode lately. I would explore another phone. I know you can easily get Test Mode on an LG 4050 and Nokia 6340i. You can also get Test Mode on the V400 and V600 but it is a bit more complicated to get it opened.

[COMfr3aK]

Well thanks for the insight, it gives me a little more comfort to know my issue is not un-heard of. I will simply keep calling them now and then to remind them until it's fixed and maybe look into a test mode capable handset..

I know the network menu is taken out of the nokia's but what other handsets allow you to specify the network you're on?

[Andy]

Originally Posted by bobolito

COMfr3aK, it will be a great help to tell us where you are. It is hard to offer opinions when we have no idea what part of the country (city/state) you are from.

I don't believe the problem is with your phone. I have experienced the same exact issue in Providence, RI and I know it is not my phone because it doesn't do that in NJ, PA or CT. The problem may be in your closest tower not having enough capacity and the call is handed over to more distant towers. However, when you hang up your phone shows full signal because it switches back to the control channel of the closest tower. As much as we know the T720 is problematic, this time I don't believe the problem is with the phone. Call Cingular and report the problem. If there's no resolution ask them to switch you back to TDMA or cancel service. I know they don't want to hear that.

This is very well possible; try the following. Call you cellphone when it's at home, showing full bars, see if it rings. My guess would be that it doesn't, since you cannot make any outgoing calls. You say the same thing is happening to your Nokia GSM phone, hence, something is wrong with the GSM part of the site, because you said TDMA works, right?

[COMfr3aK]

Originally Posted by Andy84094

This is very well possible; try the following. Call you cellphone when it's at home, showing full bars, see if it rings. My guess would be that it doesn't, since you cannot make any outgoing calls. You say the same thing is happening to your Nokia GSM phone, hence, something is wrong with the GSM part of the site, because you said TDMA works, right?

No I can send/receive calls on the GSM. The difference is the TDMA would send/receieve with full solid reception and never drop calls. The GSM always says 5 solid bars and then as soon as you answer or send it drops to 2-3 bars and sometimes 1 and drops the call but I can always send/receieve. It is just after you send or answer the call the service practically dies when it says it has 5 solid bars just sitting there. I know it's the GSM side of the site, the TDMA off the same tower worked flawlessy, I think I remember it dropping one call in like 2 years.

[Gideon H]

Originally Posted by bobolito

You can also get Test Mode on the V400 and V600 but it is a bit more complicated to get it opened.

And how would you do that on a V600? I'm sorta having the same problem but I think I know what it is.

[Rasputin]

I would call in and complain about the tower. I would also see if you have similiar problems on any other towers. It would help if you can put it in test mode and look at the signal levels.

[PAcell]

I've had problems in Central PA. First I was on AT&T's digital network (have been since my first phone in 99), then just recently wanted to upgrade and get a new phone. All have always had great signal at my house with AT&T, but as soon as I switched to Cingular (begining of Dec. '04) I have had nothing but problems. My signal constanly is up and down, I'll have full signal and try to make a call and boom, no signal, then wait 3 to 5 minutes for signal to come back and try my call again. Or, after hanging up from a call, signal will drop to nothing, again, wait 3-5 minutes before I make my next call. I called Cingular and they said not all towers are converted yet. I have not had many dropped calls but I can't make or receive about 25% of my calls. The problem only seems to be about a 1/2 mile to 1 mile around my house. Everywhere else I get better signal. Not acceptable though by me, esspecialy since my brother who has AT&T on the GSM network gets full signal at my house. If they don't switch all the towers soon, I am going with Verizon, even if I have to pay a cancelation fee.

[scotsboyuk]

There seems to be quite a bit of discussion on problems with signal strength and coverage issues in America, are these widespread problems in the U.S.?

[bobolito]

Originally Posted by Gideon H

And how would you do that on a V600? I'm sorta having the same problem but I think I know what it is.

You need MSS VictorGSM software (with your data cable) to enable Test Mode, then a sequence of keystrokes to activate it. As an alternative, you can download a file from the phone using P2Kman, then use a hex editor to modify the file and finally, upload the modified file back to the phone.

Originally Posted by scotsboyuk

There seems to be quite a bit of discussion on problems with signal strength and coverage issues in America, are these widespread problems in the U.S.?

Yes, they are quite widespread.

[scotsboyuk]

@bobolito

I can't say that I have ever had any problems with signal coverage whilst I have been in America, mind you I have only really ever been to major urban areas so I haven't had any experience of using a mobile in smaller towns or in the countryside.

Do any of the tube systems in the U.S. have network coverage?

[ZaphodB]

Verizon have coverage in the DC metro; Cingular have coverage in the San Francisco BART system, but only in certain areas; T-Mobile have coverage in the Boston T. In a little while, Chicago will have full coverage for all carriers on the Red and Blue lines of the El. Most of the MARTA system in Atlanta is covered by Cingular and T-Mobile. Los Angeles had a tender out for buildout in the Red Line but I don't think it was ever completed. (The LA Metro isn't very popular since there's only four lines and mostly serves to take people downtown.)

[scotsboyuk]

Britain doesn't have any network coverage in any of the tube systems. Apparently the Tokyo tube system has top notch coverage, which would be very nice if we had it too.

[bobolito]

There is some sporadic coverage in the tubes (also known as the subway). However, this is because signal bleeds over from outside. Some stations have undergroud coverage by certain carriers, but it quite limited. For instance, in NYC, Cingular has coverage in the Metro North tracks when you are near the Grand Central station. Up north from there, it dies. No other carrier has coverage there. Additionally in NYC, I believe Verizon has coverage at the Path underground train stops. In Boston, T-Mobile has coverage in their T train system. Others may be better informed than me about this.

Also, when driving, you will have a much better experience since most tunnels are already covered and highway coverage is very extensive.

[whosurbud]

"However, now with the moto t720 when making calls the phone will say 5 full bars of service but as soon as you actually start making a call, the bars will drop to 1 or 2 and sometimes the call will die. Then as soon as you end the call it pops right back to 5 bars. I tried using a hands free holding the phone away from my ear but makes no difference. I thought it was the phone so I replaced it with a new moto t720 and it does the same thing."

That would be the effect of Power Control. When you place a call and the signal strength meter drops down, there's nothing wrong. The system is powering down to serve you since as you said, the site is outside ur window. This is done on purpose to keep calls close to sites, from interfering
with someone else, further away. On the flip side, if your close to the site, your phone is told by the system to not transmit as much power, thus controlling the phones from causing undue interference outside the intended service area, and just as importantly conserving battery life. Contrary to popular belief, good service does not hinge on STRONG signals. It hinges on CLEAN signals eg- minimize the interference. That goes for any technology, GSM, TDMA, CDMA or god help you Analog (j/k).

Now if your noticing a phone dropping calls, it could be for any number of reasons. But I can assure you, if the site really is outside your window, as you said, it has nothing to do with the amount of signal as shown on the cheezy little bar graph shown on the display (as in, when ur that close, any amount of signal should be enough). More likely, either a phone problem, or a problem with the site serving you. In either case ya should "take it where ya bought it" and mention the problem with the customer service people. More often than not they can help you or they know someone who can.

whosurbud

[COMfr3aK]

Well this was a thread I started in June of 2004 and there have been some changes since then. Most notably in August I finally killed my TDMA and moved to GSM. I got a nokia 3595 and the coverage was much better in my area with gsm. I just a few days ago upgraded again and got a v220 and a 64k SIM and am still testing to see if it makes a difference.

Cingular screwed that all up as they sent me the phone and the SIM so I called to activate the new sim and the rep said there was an issue so she put in a technical request for it to be looked at. She said I would get a call in 24-48 hours at my home number when they were ready to change. Well long story short they activated my new sim sometime Wednesday morning and NEVER called me and I walked out today (Wed 1/19) into a huge storm in the northeast with a phone that said "Unregistered Sim". The one day I don't flip open my phone just to take a peak but I was rushing out the door. I was rather livid to say they least when I was an hour from home in a white out and no cell phone to alert people of my status. They did give me a $10 credit for the screw up so I'm happy enough. But had I got in an accident......

However, to the original thread I have noticed we no longer drop calls at all. I notice the signal fluctuate but we have not dropped a call in probably 5-6 months now. Perhaps they improved something. Calls are still clear while the bars jump around which is all I care about. I know the bars on the phone are a very weak judge of actual signal but back when I posted in June about it I was frustrated at dropping calls and thought signal had something to do with it.

[Fire14]

However, to the original thread I have noticed we no longer drop calls at all. I notice the signal fluctuate but we have not dropped a call in probably 5-6 months now.

Well it's good to hear that everything is alot better for you up there, It's a shame about them updating the other SIM & not calling you, especially with the storm. At least they were nice enough to give a credit though.

I try not to worry too much about the signal as it fluctuate's, I haven't seen it happen that much & it was happening alot when they were turning on & tuning the 850 channels.