5 bars and still horrible reception. why?

[Lithy]

I hope you guys can help explain something for me. And I am sure that many of you have experienced this -for sure if you have AT&T in many parts of Los Angeles-.

The numbers of bars is typically 4 or 5 and yet you get extensive breaking up of the voice..sometimes for many seconds consecutively and requently the call gets dropped. When this happens and you check the bars sometimes they are zero but most of the time there are 5.
hard to make a call. 5 bars and calls require 5 or 6 attempts to go thru.

I contacted AT&T and got the run around ("weather can affect coverage", "we constantly try and improve the service" lots of fluff with no real teeth). I explained that describing this type of service as "best" in their map if at a minium misleading.

What actually causes this? Is this tower overload? Would this issue be helped by a wireless extender such as zBoost?

THANKS!

[RadioRaiders]

If you have a bad quality voice connection with "full bars", then it can be due to:

-Interference from neighboring towers with the same or adjacent frequencies. This would be a network engineering fault and it would happen all the time in the same area.

-Congestion at the tower could force the phone to choose a lower bit-rate codec (ie: take 3.5kbps instead of 12kbps, or something like that). As you know from mp3 players, lower bit rates don't usually sound so good. This would happen only during busy times (usually lunch, dinner times)

-Congested backhaul from the tower to the switch could cause voice traffic to become degraded. This would also be an engineering problem, and only happen during busy times (lunch, dinner times)

Sounds like congestion (since you also mentioned blocked calls), but really, it could be alot of things. Customer Serivce most likely won't know. You can report it to them, and hope they pass it along to their Network Optimization team (who anyway monitors the network from statistics, and should see any major problems). Maybe they will reply back to you. Who knows

PS- A wireless extender or repeater won't help you in this case, since they are good for repeating weak signals with good quality, not strong signals with bad quality.

[Lithy]

Thanks RadioRaiders-
the last reply I got from AT&T said they would submit a ticket is as follows:

"I have submitted a network quality ticket based on the information you
provided me with. This ticket is for informational purposes only, you
will not be contacted and we will not receive any feedback on the status
of the ticket once it has been worked. An estimated date when the
coverage will be improved your area is not available."

Should I push harder?
This is my home address and I do not have a landline. I have an iPhone and I am stuck with AT&T (T-mobile used to be wonderful). What else can I do?

[Blue4Life]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (SymbianOS/9.1; U; en-us) AppleWebKit/413 (KHTML, like Gecko) Safari/413 es70)

If you know others in your area that are having similar issues, have them report the issue also. The more complaints they get, the better your chances of getting the issue resolved.

[Lithy]

Everybody I know who has AT&T has experienced this when being in my area I will ask them to report it.

I asked my neighbors more details. Their description of the issue is that basically the signal drops from 5 to 0 bars suddenly every few minutes resulting in long silent pauses ("are you there?") and frequently in dropped calls (fast busy signal). Does this help in pinpointing the problem so that I can ensure to have the people who are interested report this consistently?

Thanks,
Lithy

[RadioRaiders]

Originally Posted by Lithy

Everybody I know who has AT&T has experienced this when being in my area I will ask them to report it.

I asked my neighbors more details. Their description of the issue is that basically the signal drops from 5 to 0 bars suddenly every few minutes resulting in long silent pauses ("are you there?") and frequently in dropped calls (fast busy signal). Does this help in pinpointing the problem so that I can ensure to have the people who are interested report this consistently?

Thanks,
Lithy

If you see a sudden loss of bars on your phone, that means the network pushed you to a tower further away, probably because the one closer to you is congested. AT&T must see in their network statistics that this area suffers alot of congestion and dropped/blocked calls. The only thing they can do is add more capacity to existing sites, or build new ones to offload the traffic.

Your calling and complaining may help force the issue (but don't do it excessively, or they'll write you off as being whiney!) and having your neighbors call is good too. But otherwise, I don't think there's much you can do but wait to AT&T to put more capacity in your area (and how long that takes depends on some other variables too, like if their existing sites are maxed out already, or if they can't get new sites)...well, if you say T-Mob is better in your area, then unlock your iPhone and go back to T-Mob...

[Lithy]

Thanks. I will try and have a few people report the issue. Should not be hard this is a VERY densely populated area with tons of condo buildings.

- If I am pushed to a far away tower, then maybe a wireless extender *will* help a bit.I ma willing to try anything that can help, even marginally. I was thinking to try and buy one as a test and then if i see no improvement return it within 30 days. What do you think? which would you recommend?

- Any good resources/websites for switching my iPhone to TMO? I would like to still be able to use the data service and get software updates from Apple within a reasonable amount of time after they are available (visual voicemail?keep same number?). The timeing might be nice as I am planning to upgrade to IpHone 3G.

Thanks.

[RadioRaiders]

Originally Posted by Lithy

- If I am pushed to a far away tower, then maybe a wireless extender *will* help a bit.I ma willing to try anything that can help, even marginally. I was thinking to try and buy one as a test and then if i see no improvement return it within 30 days. What do you think? which would you recommend?.

If the cause is congestion and not interference (which can be independent of each other in GSM networks) then a repeater may help you with a connection to a tower further away. In CDMA (Verizon, Sprint) and WCDMA (AT&T's 3G) congestion leads directly to interference, but not in GSM (AT&T's 2G).

For a info on a repeater, use the search function, it's been covered a million time. I hear Wilson is good, but I personally have no experience with any home repeaters.

[RadioFoneGuy]

The Socal area has been notorious for audio issue, most of which stem back to the AT&T Wireless buyout.

I was out there in 2004 and was able to switch back and forth between Cingular and ATTWS and only had issues on the ATTWS network.

Are your problems recent or occuring for awhile?

If my memory serves right until this year AT&T was still using the old ATTWS MNC in Cali and Nevada then switched to Cingulars 410.

Seems like anytime make a OTA SIM update there are issues for a couple of months.

I just had a SIM update for an Alpha Tag update and now Ive got dropped calls and fluctuating bars. I know for fact its not a network or handset issue.

[spleck]

Considering your location, you're probably in a 3G area. Upgrading to the 3G iPhone or any other 3G phone may 'resolve' your call issues. You'll probably be able to get a new 3G iPhone sooner than they'll upgrade the GSM capacity in your area.

Perhaps see if you can borrow a 3G/UMTS phone and use your SIM to test it out for a bit.

[tmobileman]

Originally Posted by Lithy

Should I push harder?
This is my home address and I do not have a landline. I have an iPhone and I am stuck with AT&T (T-mobile used to be wonderful). What else can I do?

Crack your iphone and come back to tmobile, I hate the IPHONE...HATE IT HATE IT HATE IT ok, I am done, you should come back to tmobile

[spleck]

Originally Posted by tmobileman

Crack your iphone and come back to tmobile, I hate the IPHONE...HATE IT HATE IT HATE IT ok, I am done, you should come back to tmobile

Tmobileman, you gotta lay off the late night drinking and posting!

[treotosh]

Originally Posted by RadioRaiders

If you see a sudden loss of bars on your phone, that means the network pushed you to a tower further away, probably because the one closer to you is congested. AT&T must see in their network statistics that this area suffers alot of congestion and dropped/blocked calls. The only thing they can do is add more capacity to existing sites, or build new ones to offload the traffic.

Your calling and complaining may help force the issue (but don't do it excessively, or they'll write you off as being whiney!) and having your neighbors call is good too. But otherwise, I don't think there's much you can do but wait to AT&T to put more capacity in your area (and how long that takes depends on some other variables too, like if their existing sites are maxed out already, or if they can't get new sites)...well, if you say T-Mob is better in your area, then unlock your iPhone and go back to T-Mob...

Use a Iphone on T-mobile!! :::::::::::::::::::: Sign of the cross::::::::::::::::::::::::: Useing a Iphone on a T-mobile network will eliminate the Edge network on the phone. So basicly you will have to be stuck with Wi-Fi.

[Eric47]

any ATT 3G device will have much clearer calling, and in my experience, holds onto a signal much better.

[Lithy]

ok. My AT&T service continues to sucks. Lately the signal strength has been oscillating at the same identical location from "No service" to 1 bar to 5 bars within minutes. Calls do not go thru, eventually connect with tons of break ups.

The iPhone 3G is coming out today. Several posters in this thread suggested that the 3G network will have better signal. I am happy with my original iPhone but would upgrade to the 3G simply for the better signal.

1) Are the two networks (2G vs. 3G) independent and therefore 3G is likely to be less congested and "better"?
2) Does anybody have direct experience with AT&T in the 90069 zip near Holloway Blvd, Sunset Strip? Is it better?
3) Will iPhone 3G work the same as an original iPhone in non-3G covered areas for both voice and data?

Thanks!

[spleck]

1. They're not independent (they're on the same towers), but they're usually on different bands. Regardless, the air interface is different and should have superior resistance to interference..
2. IDK
3. Yes, the iPhone 3G will handle GSM/EDGE just like the original iPhone--no reduction of capabilities.

[wiseacre]

You could always drop ATT, switch to Verizon, and that will never happen again.

[hillbilly44]

Originally Posted by spleck

1. They're not independent (they're on the same towers), but they're usually on different bands. Regardless, the air interface is different and should have superior resistance to interference..
2. IDK
3. Yes, the iPhone 3G will handle GSM/EDGE just like the original iPhone--no reduction of capabilities.

WRONG;

They are independent networks ,the fact the antennas are on the same tower means nothing the base stations (cellsite equipment are independent of each other along with other equipment. Also, they (both 3G & 2G) can be on the same band there just has to be the correct channel separation. Now you can do an IRAT, which means you can hand down from 2G to 3G in areas if conjestion or if you move out of a 3G area. Yes the air interface is different but what makes it different besides that it the ability of the network to use QOS to give you the best quality phone call, that's why it's better.

[spleck]

Originally Posted by hillbilly44

WRONG;

Thanks for using tact. I said 3G was better and so did you.

They're not completely independent in that they're collocated at the same sites and you won't find 3G where you don't have GSM. Yes, they are separate in that they have separate call capacities. My point about WCDMA being superior to the TDMA in GSM still stands and is not "WRONG."

Further, "band" is a generic word and does not specifically refer to FCC allocated spectrum blocks. But thanks for arguing semantics--its real helpful.

Also, how does QOS help with signal reception? QOS is about packet delivery--it has no effect on signal strength. You might be thinking of adaptive modulation which adapts to varying link qualities.

SORRY for mis-wording something!

[Barciurek]

lol I finally was able to use the iPhone.. that thing.. sucks.
I'm looking forward to get Nokia e90..

[hillbilly44]

Originally Posted by spleck

Thanks for using tact. I said 3G was better and so did you.

They're not completely independent in that they're collocated at the same sites and you won't find 3G where you don't have GSM. Yes, they are separate in that they have separate call capacities. My point about WCDMA being superior to the TDMA in GSM still stands and is not "WRONG."

Further, "band" is a generic word and does not specifically refer to FCC allocated spectrum blocks. But thanks for arguing semantics--its real helpful.

Also, how does QOS help with signal reception? QOS is about packet delivery--it has no effect on signal strength. You might be thinking of adaptive modulation which adapts to varying link qualities.

SORRY for mis-wording something!

Acutally they are completely independent, a GSM base station is different than the Node B (which is what the 3G Network uses for a BTS) so there are instances where you have 3G sites and no GSM. That's where IRAT comes in. it will allow a hand off between the two technologies. QOS doesd't help with signal strength but since all CDMA based systems are noise based you need something to qualify who has access to the network (voice or data). So QOS enables you to make a call by reducing interference. Hope this helps.